Metropolitan Policemen who served in the Great War

[high wood]

Does anyone know of any lists of Metropolitan Policemen who served in the Great War. I have a list of those killed in action from MEPO 4/344 which I have cross referenced with a Roll of Honour for a service held in Westminster Abbey on the 17th May 1919 which lists the men by division and collar number. I am looking for information on those who served and survived.

I am looking to identify a couple of policemen from their division letters and collar numbers (not warrant numbers). Does anyone know if this is possible? Does such a list exist?

[kenf48]

Does anyone know of any lists of Metropolitan Policemen who served in the Great War.

I am looking to identify a couple of policemen from their division letters and collar numbers (not warrant numbers). Does anyone know if this is possible? Does such a list exist?

1. No, but very interested.

2. Very difficult but not impossible, have you tried the Friends of the Metropolitan Police Historical Collection?

Ken

[Guest]

Don't know of any lists, but one of the men I am researching, served as a Policeman. I just emailed the main local Police station ( Perth ) Turns out they have an archivist, and an extremely helpful one at that. I received quite a bit of information, and a photograph.

Might be worth asking HERE. or your local station.

Mike

[Kevin Lynott]

High Wood

If you want to track a Met Officer it is advidsable to have his/her warrant number. A warrant number is a unique reference for each officer who joins the Met(it is only used once whether the officer resigns after lunch on the first day at training school or serves for 40 years).

When a uniform officer moves from Div to Div or Dept they are issued with a new collar number. I myself had four different collar numbers when I served in the Met.

The tel No of the MetPol Historical Collection is 0207 161 1234

or e-mail historicstore@met.police.uk

Kevin

[Hywyn]

A previous thread which discussed the Met. I can't recall all the links off it now but there may be something that will give you a starter

http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/i...7&hl=police

Hywyn

[spof]

A list of warrant numbers can be found here:

http://yourarchives.nationalarchives.gov.u...ords_of_Service

[ppikesley]

hi hywyn, i have a large database of police officers surnames printed off from the old police orders web site when it was up and running.if you give me names i may have some details on them. like warrant and collar number and service details. paul

[ppikesley]

hi again i do have a list of city of london police officers who was killed in the war. the list only gives the names of the officers if that can help anyone paul

[bigronhartley]

Hello Paul

Hope you don't mind my trying to pick your brains. I am looking for information about Fred Percival Ward, who was a member of the Police Ambulance Service. I wondered if you might be able to advise the best place to look for records. Also if he appears on your large database of police officers surnames printed off from the old police orders web site. Thanks.

Regards

Ron

[ppikesley]

hi ironduke, i can,t help you on any police ambulance service officers.i got a 1902 police ambulance service medal from a group of 6 medals and i can,t find any records on the police ambulance officers.i try the n/a and the met museum with no joy sorry about that.my 1902 medal is named to pte.g.b.f. chuchill he ended after ww11 has a lieutenant-colonel in the ramc.i do have a breakdown for the 1897 medal for which organisations got there numbers of medals. eg 3rd bn east kent regt surgeons 2, officers 3,men 32. paul

[high wood]

I don't have the names of the men in the photographs that I want to identfy and therefore cannot find their warrant numbers. I can tell you their collar numbers. I can also tell you the collar numbers of the Metropolitan policemen who died during the Great War.

What I need to know is has anyone cross referenced Metropolitan police officer's names and warrant numbers with their divisional collar numbers?

[kenf48]

The warrant number, as said above is unique, issued sequentially on joining the Metropolitan Police. The collar number is issued locally. These days as mentioned above officers may move more often than in the Great War period and every time the officer moves from a local unit (or Division) the number will change and be reissued, therefore such a contemporary database is not possible and of limited value for the organisation.

However, in the period under review there was far less change/reorganisation therefore such a list may exist, but I suggest at a local level. As with finding service records you will need an element of luck to find a contemporaneous report. Administrative changes to boundaries etc make your task even more difficult.

Ken

QUICK EDIT T o clarify When I joined in pre computer days there was the Book 1 held at Division (sub division) which listed both numbers (I guess as it was Book 1 it was the same back in the Great War) but in the sixties it was a loose leaf post binder so I don't know if any have survived.

[high wood]

Ken,

thank you for your continued explanation. Here is a cracking photograph of Metropolitan police constable E.272. I know from the collar numbers of other Metropolitan policeman who were killed during the Great War that this photograph is of the right period. It is a great shame that we may never know who he is. I was hoping that a list of those from E Division who served might have survived.

PC E.196 William John Hines. WN 102789

PC E.272 ?

PC E.300 Samuel Handley. WN 97154

PC E.321 John Reginald Hale. WN 105145

PC E.328 Gordon Smith. WN 96592

PC E.458 W Judge

PC E.577 John Maurice Green. WN 104720

I appreciate that the collar numbers were those in use just prior to when the men enlisted in the military services and may not have been their only numbers.

Edited 10 August by high wood
Correcting typos.

[Paul Stephens]

Hi folks

I'm not sure how useful this will be to any of you, but a lot of work has been done of the 'Your Archives' wiki to index and photograph ledgers and registers of Metropolitan Police service.

http://yourarchives.nationalarchives.gov.u...ords_of_Service

I am not inolved in the project so can't offer anything more than a heads up.

I have also seen a few MICs which record soldiers who were also members of the Met. They are noted on the reverse 'Commissioner Met. Pol. forwards Roll of P.C.s entitled to medals'.

I hope this of use to someone.

Cheers

Paul

[Kevin Lynott]

High Wood

When an officer joins/promoted/demoted/tranfers/resigns/dismissed there will be a one line entry in what is known as Police Orders which used to be published every Tuesday and Friday. It is a one line entry under the appropriate heading as mentioned for joining/promotion/demotion/tranfer/resignation/dismissal along the lines of PC 272 E/Warrant number ___ NAME___ . So there will be two entrries for PC272E one for when he resigned to join the military and the second for when he rejoined. The Met stopped all recruitment during the war and he may have been re-issued with the same shoulder number.

Now comes the hard bit. The MPHS at Post # hold copies of the said Police Orders. It would require a manual search to identify 272E either resigning or rejoining the Met. PC 272E will have had two warrant numbers because as mentioned before each number is only used once, so when he left to enlist, the record against his first warrant number would have been closed and upon rejoining he would haved been 'issued' with the next running number.

Kevin

[bigronhartley]

Hello Paul,

Thanks very much for your reply. F P Ward also got a 1902 Police Ambulance Coronation Medal, and later served with the RAMC (TF) 1/3rd London Field Ambulance in the Great War. Thanks for your help, it is much appreciated.

Regards

Ron