Would You Give Up Your Whole Database

[NeilEvans]

Following on from this topic

http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/i...p;#entry1414340

Would you, the people of the forum with large databases, willingly send the whole thing to any one who asks for it? I for one, wouldn't.

For those who have not got databases, would you ask for one?

Neil

I'd rather this thread not get heated. Here's to hoping

[Rockdoc]

In saying that I would not send my data to anyone, there are a number of Pals who have helped me in various ways during its compilation and who would receive a copy without a second thought if they asked. I'd also agree with a writer on the other thread that it's not good to have information gathering dust. I have every intention of making the information available in some form, although I first need to decide what I am trying to get from it!

I wouldn't expect anyone to make their entire research available to me but I'd hope that they'd be prepared to send me extracts to assist in my own work. I don't see the need to reinvent wheels so I'd certainly be prepared to précis relevant information for an enquirer.

Keith

[Graham Stewart]

Database information can be a two way street as I have also found in the past, but to give up a lifetimes work, just because someone thinks you should is in my opinion complete madness. So if they're that keen on buying my DB they can have it at a £1 per name and they wouldn't get much change out of a large five figure sum.

[Guest]

I don't have much of a database, and wouldn't be prepared to send it to anyone, if I had. I agree with Keith.

I would be happy to help anyone with any information they might require . If someone asked me, what percentage of the men you have on your database were x,y, or z, then would have no problem with that.

Cheers Mike

[NeilEvans]

Soon be large Mike.

I've yet to come across an owner of a database who is unwilling to do any searches.

Neil

Off to bed. Mods fell free to close this if needs be.

Neil

[David B]

I am in the Mike and Keith category, I would give snippets but the whole data base, not on your nelly, and further more I would never ask

anyone for his whole data base - like pinching the crown jewels.

Cheers David

[Andrew Hesketh]

I have voted no to the question posed "would you...willingly send the whole thing to anyone who asks for it?" (my italics).

However, I have no particular problem with sharing, depending on the reason. For example, I have offered one (I have two) to my town council to assist their consideration of whether to add 'missing' names to the war memorial in time for 2014. However, I would not give it to any passer by who simply had an interest. But, on the whole, I am more willing to share than not to share. The driving force for me is 'remembrance', and it's somewhat counter-intuitive to assume that not sharing somehow furthers that ambition.

I have shared details of individuals willingly with relatives, though often in the hope of something in return (in terms of extra info), and will continue to do so even if there's no chance of anything in return. A few weeks ago I had a stand at a local history fair in Tibshelf, Derbyshire, displaying my files and photo's backed up by a powerpoint. An elderly lady approached me and asked if I'd come across a particular chap. I had. I had loads of details, a photo of his grave and a photo of him. The lady was astounded. It transpired that she was his niece and neither she nor her sister had ever seen his photo. I have photocopied everything I have and sent it on to her. I've got zilch in return, except a feeling of having served a brave man's memory well. And that's enough for me.

[delta]

I voted no to each item but....

One of the joys of research is to share the findings with those who have an interest.

If others did not share, I certainly would not have learned as much as I have; those from this Forum has given most generously

My website had allowed me to both share and receive help.

But given that I hope to publish my research some day, not everything I have found is on display. ottherwise some one may beat me to it

S

[Andy Wade]

I also voted no to each item.

My project is eventually going to be publicly available but probably not in its entirety and I would be somewhat suspicious of anyone who wanted the whole thing. (I am aware of the other thread that spawned this question.)

Because it will be publicly available then anyone who wants any visible information may just help themselves as it is intended to be a historical and educational resource and a war memorial in its own right, but there is a large amount of information that won't be visible.

Having said that, I absolutely agree with Andrew H. I have also given quite a lot of information to a couple of people but received little or nothing in return except all that mattered. Their grateful thanks.

[martinclift]

As I said on the other thread:

We all do what we feel is the right thing and we follow our own minds. No one should be condemned for doing what they feel is right.

Isn't it all about the freedom our forefathers fought and died for?

Martin

[high wood]

My database is largely in the form of a photographic archive which I am willing to make available to anyone to help with their research. In return I hope to receive information about individuals whose images I have and a credit if photographic images are published. In practice this works well as I am no longer in the position of being able to visit the National Archives as regularly as I used to.

Research takes a lot of time and sometimes a lot of money. Rescuing old photographs costs a lot of money and I would hate to see a finalised bill for the amount of money that I have spent over the years. That said, this isn't about money or the amount of hours that we have put in to our researching and building our databases; for me it is about keeping alive the memories of those men and women who served during the Great War to ensure our freedom and to prevent their individual photographs, letters, and other effects from disapppearing into the dustbin oh history. Were we not exhorted to Let those who come after see to it that his name be not forgotten?

[auchonvillerssomme]

What amuses me are the posters who say they have x number of men on their database but then say they wouldn't share it, which is absolutely fine after all they put the effort and expense in, but why tell us they have it except to boast. Its a bit like saying I have a rolex watch but I'm never going to tell anyone the time.

Mick

[Nigel Marshall]

Something which has served as one of the attractions of this forum for me and, I'm sure, many others, is the willingness of members to help others. Many times I have been gifted information gleaned from long hours of research by members of this forum. I have reciprocated also and provided information and advice as and when I'm able.

I wouldn't expect anyone to provide me with the whole of their research, but nor would I think it reasonable to ask for it.

Some of the information I have been given is central to other peoples research and is, or has been, due for publication and I have been asked to 'keep it under my hat', which I have been happy to do. Some of this information is pretty specialised and of interest to only a small number of people, but I recently learned something, which will change peoples understanding of a particular battle in its entirity, and will dispell a myth that has been perpetuated for decades. It is a truly monumental bit of knowledge, but I wouldn't dream of splashing this on the forum or doing anything with it. I think what grates with people more than anything else is that some people, including forum members, have received information in this manner and it has very quickly found its way on to the forum, or has been copied and distributed without the consent of the person who provided it in the first place and in spite of requests not to post or distribute it. Indeed one forum members name has been mentioned on numerous occasions by quite a number of forum pals that I have had contact with and people like this spoil that spirit of co-operation by their cynical behaviour. The only way to combat this is to not provide anything to that person. I've never been a fan of collective punishment, it doesn't work. The trouble is that you have to get your fingers burnt to find out who you can't trust, and you have constantly to repeat the risk of getting your fingers burnt if you want to help people.

The idea of collating the names of those who served and survived the war to complement the databases of those who died is, as has been stated elsewhere, a noble one and the sentiment of it should be applauded. The practicalities of it are unimaginable and in all probability impossible to achieve.

Those of us who collect and collate information relating to a group of people such as soldiers do it with our own requirements in mind, each of us is different and so it follows that each of us will have differing needs from what we collect. A hypothetical database inclusive of everyone must, therefore, be impossibly enormous, or be trimmed so as to ignore many, many hours of work that the researcher responsible might not be willing to endure.

I would like to think that everyone who I have provided information to would keep a record of where it came from so that if it is used in future, a credit might be given, but I'm not naive enough to think that everyone retains source information for every snippet of information they have been given.

I wouldn't hand over the entire contents of any of my databases. One details fewer than 200 men, another, almost 13,000, and the third will never have anymore than (I think) 39. All have been hard work to put together. I am though very happy to provide information from them, because I doubt very much that the information held on it is known exclusively to me. If they don't get it from me, they'll get it somewhere else.

I hope this all makes sense!

Cheers,

Nigel

[Ron Clifton]

My databases are not lists of names, but orders of battle, war establishments or the Kew class-lists, so whilst I am willing to share bits of them, or do lookups, very few people would want the full database. When I retired as WFA Historical Information Officer, I passed a copy of the WO95 class-list to my successor, but otherwise I have not shared full databases.

Ron

[redescort]

What amuses me are the posters who say they have x number of men on their database but then say they wouldn't share it, which is absolutely fine after all they put the effort and expense in, but why tell us they have it except to boast. Its a bit like saying I have a rolex watch but I'm never going to tell anyone the time.

Mick

Mick

I'm not sure that anyone the forum who has a database would be unwilling to search it and provide that piece of information to whoever requested it, isn't that sharing. I like others on the forum have a database which contains in x number of men online which anyone can freely search isn't that sharing.

Ray

[Desmond7]

All my research (and the work of a local colleague) is available free to whoever comes across it on the web. Everyone to their own opinion but I originally joined forum to help with the compilation of more details on 'my men'. I received a great deal of help in the process and hopefully have returned that initial help with interest.

My main concern was to get as much info 'out there' for people to see.

Whenever I am asked by someone if they can use stuff from the site for their own work I merely ask that the site be credited.

Whether I would do any significant work in terms of providing that data in some specified format to another person is an entirely different issue. Frankly, it too me long enough to gather the stuff I have and to present it in its present format. As I see it, every time someone looks at the site is spreading the 'gospel' of how important the WW1 era actually was to communities at every level. And that can only be a good thing.

Des

[Graham Stewart]

What amuses me are the posters who say they have x number of men on their database but then say they wouldn't share it, which is absolutely fine after all they put the effort and expense in, but why tell us they have it except to boast. Its a bit like saying I have a rolex watch but I'm never going to tell anyone the time.

Mick

"Boasting" or protecting? It would take a short time to transfer a massive DB to the public domain and then what? Every medal dealer in the country would be downloading it for the purpose of ripping off collectors even more. Then there those who would create booklets from it and charge you all for a copy.

So what about the researcher who has dedicated his life to his DB, with the aim of sharing it with families, forum members and like minded friends increasing the information further? About all he'll get for a lifetimes work is those others smiling and rubbing their hands with glee thinking what a "gullable mug" he was.

[wesleycrabb]

Hello All,

As a relative newbie to 'individual man' research I may have a slightly different angle on this question.

I have been a member of this forum for approx 2 months only, and in that short space of time have gathered, in my opinion, as much information as my spare time allows, mostly from you, the other forum members, to process. However, I have also discovered a little info myself, mostly from local knowledge, which I think has been of use to others, and I would always be willing to share.

I think, and hope, the main aim of everyone here is trying to achieve the continued rememberance of the individuals who fought in The Great War, and 'sitting' on information will not do that (IMO).

Having said that, I do not expect, and would never ask/expect a fellow forum member to give up their 'database' to all and sundry.

I think a little middle ground needs to found, and the more we know about people and thier motives, the more we will trust them with the information we have.

So my answer is no, not everything.

Toodleoo

Wes.

[BJanman]

I can’t be bothered worrying about medal collectors downloading, I feel ripped off every time I get a train or park my car.

The RAMC in the Great War was too big an organisation for any one person to research all of it’s personnel. The fact that most official documents state men served with the RAMC and not the unit, as well as most of the service records being destroyed and the temporary officers files missing means it is virtually impossible for people to trace their relative’s war service. The RAMC database is on-line to help people. It is an on-going collection of research by me and others, which also includes medal collectors and authors - some you win, some you lose. The best part for me is when I receive emails from people advising that the database has help them or how proud they feel to see their relative on the database, and I get quite a lot of them.

Having said that I do understand why people are protective of their work. I have found it difficult to answer the poll as I have several databases on medical units and would happily pass at least one onto some people but not others, it would depend on who was asking, why they were asking and how readily available the information is for them to do their own research. Everything I obtain and work on will be given to the AMS Museum.

Barbara

[Retlaw]

What amuses me are the posters who say they have x number of men on their database but then say they wouldn't share it, which is absolutely fine after all they put the effort and expense in, but why tell us they have it except to boast. Its a bit like saying I have a rolex watch but I'm never going to tell anyone the time.

Mick

but why tell us they have it except to boast

I don't boast about my data bases or information, very few people outside my local library know of my existance or what I do.

The library acts as a barrier between me and the rip of merchants.

The library also has full access to what I know.

I am my own task master, I do what I do because I want to.

If you don't like the way some people work, then tough, you sound just like those we try to avoid, gi me gi me.

Retlaw.

[Steven Broomfield]

Like Mr Clifton, my 'database' is a collection of books and so on. I have no problem with look-ups, scanning bits, and so on, but there are two "no-no" for me:

1. People who don't say thank you, and then want more.

2. People who want to have me scan the history of the umpteenth Loamshires for 1916, irrespective of the fact it's about 150 pages long!

Be specific and say Thank You and I'm happy to help. But the books did cost a few bob, so don't push it

Oh, and I don't have a Rolex, and unlike Barbara, I think South West Trains give me value for money, so I'll tell you the time for nothing and be happy on the train!

[auchonvillerssomme]

Like Mr Clifton, my 'database' is a collection of books and so on. I have no problem with look-ups, scanning bits, and so

2. People who want to have me scan the history of the umpteenth Loamshires for 1916, irrespective of the fact it's about 150 pages long!

I'm going to have pull you up on that one Stephen, the history of the Umpteenth Loamshires, can't possibly be that long, the Generic Blankshires is nowhere near that and they had a much busier 1916.

[Steven Broomfield]

I waslluding to the 1st/Umpteenth. Sorry, I should have been clearer.

[NeilEvans]

Was that an Indian Regiment?

[auchonvillerssomme]

I thought so, is that Colonel Ivor Wasluding the CO?