City and County of Cork War Dead

[Arnhem44]

Hi Sean this link would suggest another one,2nd Lieutenant Gordon Caulfield,

Regards

Brendan

http://www.cwgc.org/search/casualty_details.aspx?casualty=1751835

http://www.cliftonrfchistory.co.uk/memorial/WW1/caulfield.htm

[Sean.]

Hi Brendan,

It looks like you are right, a lot of direct information and what a story. Did you by chance come across them in any of the census returns, the only one they appear in is the 1891 UK census which is on the information link, they dont turn up on any of the Irish or any other UK returns.

Regards,

Sean

[Arnhem44]

Hi Sean,I just happened upon this yesterday whilst browsing and to be honest hadn't looked at the census because of the family moving to England.It would appear from the details on the link that someone has researched Lieutenant Caulfield and his family for the rugby club,where they got the information I do not know but with so many of the peerage class it's well known that they moved about quite often and Caulfields may of only been in Cork for a few years at most.I guess a birth certificate would confirm him been born around the Macroom area if the link is accurate.It's some family history alright and many by the looks of it served in many wars,such a pity that the census records are gone for that time it would make things like this somewhat easier to unravel.

Regards

Brendan

[Arnhem44]

Hi Sean,two more names for checking.I can't find these two anywhere and I don't know what it is about Rosscarbery men,they are proving most elusive.These two are Patrick Hayes and James O'Leary killed in action at the battle of Jutland serving on HMS Defence and the Black Prince. This one appeared in the Star on the 17th of June 1916.

Regards

Brendan

[Sean.]

Hi Brendan,

These are the men with those surnames that died on both ships, there is no connection to the two O’Leary’s to Cork but JJ Hayes is from Reenascreena, Rosscarbery, so I don’t know if it’s a mix up with names in the paper as far as Hayes is concerned, JJ Hayes is in the book. In relation to James O’Leary mentioned in the article there are a few possibility’s with that name in the Seaman’s register, but hard to pin down and we could be dealing with a non-com, but we will check it again.

Regards,

Sean

O'LEARY P 293649 HMS BLACK PRINCE 31/05/1916 ROYAL NAVY

O'LEARY E 4487S HMS BLACK PRINCE 31/05/1916 ROYAL NAVAL RESERVE

HAYES JJ J/1014 HMS DEFENCE 31/05/1916 ROYAL NAVY

[Arnhem44]

Hi Sean,I did see the casualty list for the 31st of May and saw JJ Hayes both in the book and the CWGC,the paper lists quite a few for the battle of Jutland which I must still check.As you say it may be a case that the paper has the names mixed up in some way,I initially thought that Patrick may of been a brother to JJ Hayes but can't find the census return,most likely it's there in front of me and I'm just not seeing it,long day.

Regards

Brendan

[Sean.]

Hello Brendan,

Yes indeed you could be right as far as Patrick and J J being brothers, I have a few on the seamans records that could be our men Hayes and O'Leary but it will take a bit longer to tie them up if at all, but for know they are on the list for checking. Finding them in the census is almost impossable as they were probably in the service at that time.

Thank you again.

Regards,

Sean.

[Arnhem44]

Hi Sean,last night going through my own local list I noticed that H.Coleman,Royal Navy from Castle Freke Clonakilty was never included in the book.I'm just wondering did I not send that name on in my correspondence before?.Here is the casualty details from the CWGC http://www.cwgc.org/search/casualty_details.aspx?casualty=387772 in case he was missed.Any date on an updated release of this publication?

Kind regards

Brendan

[Arnhem44]

And now for this which I've been scratching my head with.Ernest Churchill Templeton,I came across this Canadian casualty earlier in an ebook on the letters from the front of officers who served with the Canadian Bank of Commerce.It states he was born on the 8th of August 1890 in Clonakilty however his Canadian enlistment details give his birthplace as Abbeyleix and also the 1901 census has him as Queens County which ties in.The family as can be seen from the census are moving quite frequently and each child is born in a different county,one been born in Cork.Also Ernest has a brother who is also serving who does not appear to be with the family and he was born in Tipperary,I'm just wondering is it that Ernest was Born in Queens County and the banks details have it wrong below and maybe he moved to Cork as a young baby but then where would the bank of got such details relating to where he was born,would this of been information supplied to them when he joined the bank??

Regards

Brendan

Templeton, Arthur Handcock — Sergeant. Born 27th June,

1887, at Roscrea, County Tipperary, Ireland. Father, Rev. James

Bradley Templeton, Methodist Minister. Educated at Wesley

College, Dublin, and Methodist College, Belfast. Entered the

service of the Bank, 2nd November, 1911. Enlisted, 25th May,

1915, from Gleichen branch, where he was Accountant, in 45th

Canadian Battalion, with the rank of Private. Transferred to 30th

Reserve Battalion, October, 1915; 32nd Reserve Battalion, Dec-

ember, 1915; 28th (North Western) Battahon. Promoted Lance-

Corporal, 11th January, 1918; Corporal, 11th February, 1918;

Sergeant, 6th April, 1918. Principal actions: Amiens, August,

1918; Arras, Cambrai, Mons, August-November, 1918, as Lewis

Gun Non-Commissioned OfBcer. DemobiHzed, 24th May, 1919.

Returned to duty with the Bank, 16th June, 1919.

^Templeton, Ernest Churchill — Private. Born 8th August,

1890, at Clonakilty, County Cork, Ireland. Father, Rev. James

Bradley Templeton, Methodist Minister. Educated at the

Methodist College, Belfast, Ireland. Entered the service of the

Bank, 20th March, 1911. Enlisted, August, 1914, from Moosejaw

branch, in 5th Canadian Battalion, with the rank of Private.

Served as a Bombing Instructor with 5th Battalion in France.

Accidentally killed by the bursting of a bomb in his hand, 25th

May, 1917.

(Brother of A. H. Templeton).

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Larne/Clonlee/995546/

http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/databases/cef/001042-119.02-e.php?image_url=http://data2.archives.ca/cef/gpc016/629149a.gif&id_nbr=275703

http://www.ebooksread.com/authors-eng/canadian-bank-of-commerce-cn/letters-from-the-front-being-a-record-of-the-part-played-by-officers-of-the-ban-ana/page-47-letters-from-the-front-being-a-record-of-the-part-played-by-officers-of-the-ban-ana.shtml

http://www.cwgc.org/search/casualty_details.aspx?casualty=492761

[Sean.]

Hi Brendan,

Thank you for that great information on Templeton, I see what you mean about thefamily moving around, two of the sons were born in Cork before and after Ernest and some mistake could have been made but we will have to check it out more.

In relation to H Coleman, he is listed on page 500 of the book. No date has been fixed yet for the second edition, we are still going through some names and as soon as they are checked we will be in a better position to pick a date, we are trying to get it out by Christmas. In relation to the names posted on this thread I will be listing the finished list shortly for each name so that you can all just double check that i have got them all.

Thanks again,

Regards,

Sean

[Arnhem44]

Hi Sean,my apologies on Coleman,I should of spotted that one myself.Templeton is an interesting one,maybe a birth cert would tie him to the right place.I must start having a look for some more,I took a break for a while to recharge the batteries.

Regards

Brendan

[Arnhem44]

Hi Sean,I found this snippet of information over the weekend dated from the 9th of October's 1915 edition of the Star.It's not a lot to go on but I've checked the CWGC and Naval deaths and can't find him anywhere,it would suggest in a way he was living in Queenstown or somewhere I would imagine close by for a time.I've checked the census and again I can't find a match so I thought it best to put it up here and someone else may have better luck in finding out who this Captain was. It seems unusaul but not at all impossible for a service man who was merely stationed there to be mentioned in the newspaper,I just wonder is this the case with this man

[Sean.]

Hi Brendan,

This could be our man in the 1911 census, he also appears in the 1901 census also in Queenstown, he was born in Scotland as you can see but it looks like he could have been living in Cork for some years before 1901 as his grandson Robert was born here in Cork, .so I will put him on the list for checking, he is also listed on the CWGC site, I wonder why his grave location is not marked seeing as he died of an illness.

Regards,

Sean.

Residents of a house 17 in Roches Row (Queenstown No. 2 Urban, Cork) 1911.

Mac Fie Robert 58 Male Head of Family Presbyterian Scotland Seaman-master Read and write - Widower

Name: MACFIE, ROBERT

Initials: R

Nationality: United Kingdom

Rank: Master (Towing Master)

Regiment/Service: Mercantile Marine Reserve

Date of Death: 01/10/1915

Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead

Memorial: HOLLYBROOK MEMORIAL, SOUTHAMPTON

[Arnhem44]

Hi Sean,that could very well be the man in question.I had no luck myself looking for him even with variations of his name.The article does give the impression that he was here for some length of time rather than just been based here,I'm going through the paper week by week at the moment and there's lots of bits and pieces turning up,if I find anymore I'll let you know.

Regards

Brendan

[Sean.]

Thanks Brendan,

Any names that you find please post them up, I am still wondering as to why this mans grave location is not listed, as I said you would assume that as he died of an illness that this would be known, ut then again maybe they just put all relevent names on the memorial.

Regards,

Sean

[Arnhem44]

Hi Sean,would he have been buried at sea maybe,maybe on the way home or something to that effect.

Regards

Brendan

[Arnhem44]

Hi Sean,Here's another one for checking.Three Bandon soldiers reported drowned but none appear on the CWGC records,maybe a misinformed report from the paper perhaps.This appeared in the November 13th issue 1915. Below is I believe there census returns however the Munster Fusilier by the name of Connell I haven't found a match for.

Regards

Brendan

http://www.census.na..._Street/372607/

http://www.census.na..._Street/372591/

[Sean.]

Hi Brendan,

You could very well be right in relation to Robert Macfie, he could have been buried at sea but at least we have this information on him.

I cant find anything else on the three Bandon men at the moment and again you could be right in that the paper may have got it wrong, I will try and get a bit more info on them and any sinking’s in that area in November 1915.

Thank you again,

Regards,

Sean

[Arnhem44]

Hi Sean,here's one more,a Patrick O'Donovan from Dunmanway drowned on HMS Natal,the article appeared on 15th of January 1916,his date of death on the CWGC is given as 30/12/1915,the article gives it as the day after

Regards

Brendan

http://www.cwgc.org/...asualty=3042187

[Sean.]

Thanks Brendan,

This is another one for the list and I will try and get him on the census as well over the weekend, there are a few from Dunmanway but the parents names dont fit, but we will find them.

Regards,

Sean

[Arnhem44]

Hi Sean,Here's another that I've come across and it looks like he is a non com too as there is no details on the CWGC for him.Private John Callaghan RMF from Clonakilty came home on sick leave and died whilst at home and was buried here.This article appearing on the 5th of February 1916.

[Sean.]

Hello Brendan,

Another good find, well done and thank you, I will send away for a death cert for him and see what the cause of death was, we can then take it from there.

Regards,

Sean

[Sean.]

Hello Brendan,

We have a bit more information on some of the men above thanks to Jean.

It appears that your thoughts on “a misinformed newspaper report” in post 167 could be right, Jean has discovered that John Wilmot was reported home in Bandon in 1919 and had been a POW, as none of these three men are on the CWGC site it is possible it was assumed they had been killed when in fact they had survived, but we can check it again, Jean also had extra information on Robert Macfie.

We will still have to go over the others but it looks like we are looking at John Callaghan as a non Com and maybe more, again we will have to do a bit more work.

Regards,

Sean

[Arnhem44]

Hi Sean,That's good news that Jean has information on the Bandon lads.It does seem unusual that none were to be found on the CWGC,another name that has been reported is a Laurence Falvey from Barryroe at the Battle of Jutland but again he's not on the CWGC so the paper could again be misinformed,this is him I believe which is the closest match http://www.census.na...dgehane/381196/ .Another one for now is Daniel Casey from Carrigfadda Skibbereen reported killed also at the Battle of Jutland.Here's one match http://www.cwgc.org/...asualty=2865545 ,interestingly it also states that his brother has also been killed at an earlier period in the war but no date mentioned.There fathers name is Patrick and again I think this is them on the census http://www.census.na...gfadda/1155036/ http://www.census.na...part_of/440961/ ,presumably it's one of the brothers on the census but which one ?.Also Michael Holland Drishane Skibbereen is listed as been lost http://www.cwgc.org/...asualty=2866245

Regards

Brendan

[Sean.]

Hi Brendan,

Another good find thank you.

As far as I can see there is no Laurence Falvey listed in the seaman’s records and the only Falvey that I can see from the Barryroe area is a John Falvey killed in the battle of Jutland from Lehenagh, which is quite near Barryroe, he is listed in the book, he is also listed in the 1911 census at, 19 in Tehenagh, Abbeymahon, Cork, this could be him with a mix up in the names, but we can do a bit more checking.

In relation to Daniel Casey your link is right and his brother was Jeremiah Casey, Boy First Class, No J/27299, HMS Viknor, killed 13/01/1915, so these two names, along with Michael Holland will be on the list,

Many thanks.

Regards.

Sean