Alfred Henry Goodyer

[Jennifersteadman]

Hello everybody,

I wonder if any one can help me.

I am trying to trace any war records on my Grandad Alfred Henry Goodyer. Born 1899, entered the Royal marines as a band boy at the age of 11.

Served on two ships HMS Eagle and HMS Collusus. Both ships were torpedoed and after the last ship went down he was awarded a medal for keeping 2 men afloat for 18 hours.

He was then invalided out in 1921.

We thought his band number was 2107 and that would als omean his service No although when searching for him on ancestry.co.uk a different number is offered.

I've also found information that matches his birth details etc, but says he was in the RFA and his regiment number number is- 930 581 and was awarded the victory medal and the British medal. Would the victory medal be for his bravery?

I've also got Regiment Number-1523 and Regiment name- Lon Bde RFA

Can anybody help me in this? I would really, really appreciate any help that anybody can provide me with.

Thank you so much in advance.

Regards Jennifer

[TonyJ]

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documen...p;resultcount=2

Royal marine service record for your man register no. 2170 not 2107

Tonyj

[The Inspector]

Hi Jennifer

His Medal Index Card on Ancestry shows him as a driver in the RFA 930581. The medals awarded were not for "bravery" but I think they were all brave anyway. If you click on the LLT top left corner, then interpreting medal cards you will get a lot of info. No doubt someone will give you much more details.

Regards Barry

PS There are 24 pages of service records for him on Ancestry under Pension Records. If you join up to Ancestry for 14 days it is free then you can download them. Can't do it for you breach of copyright. The info. you have is correct.

Regards Barry

[Jennifersteadman]

Oh my goodness, thank, thank thank you so much!!!

My Mum, is going to be thrilled that you have managed to find him and so quickly too!!

I am truly very grateful to you.

Thank you.

So does this mean that the latter information (ie regiment number 1523 Lon Bde RFa) has nothing to do with my Grandad?

Regards Jennifer

[Jennifersteadman]

Hi Jennifer

His Medal Index Card on Ancestry shows him as a driver in the RFA 930581. The medals awarded were not for "bravery" but I think they were all brave anyway. If you click on the LLT top left corner, then interpreting medal cards you will get a lot of info. No doubt someone will give you much more details.

Regards Barry

Thank you so much Barry.

Did you get this information from the details I provided above or did you manage to find them yourself?

If you did find the information yourself, would you mind being a real friend and showing me where you found it?

Thank you ever so much, my Mum is going to be teary eyed tomorrow when I show her the help you've given me.

This is so exciting!!

Regards Jennifer

[The Inspector]

Hi Jennifer

Yes you have the correct info, see my previous post edited.

Regards Barry

[Jennifersteadman]

Hi Jennifer

His Medal Index Card on Ancestry shows him as a driver in the RFA 930581. The medals awarded were not for "bravery" but I think they were all brave anyway. If you click on the LLT top left corner, then interpreting medal cards you will get a lot of info. No doubt someone will give you much more details.

Regards Barry

PS There are 24 pages of service records for him on Ancestry under Pension Records. If you join up to Ancestry for 14 days it is free then you can download them. Can't do it for you breach of copyright. The info. you have is correct.

Regards Barry

Goodness me Barry. I wish I could see where you found 24 pages for him under pensions, cause I cant find it at all.

Luckily, I have a years subscription to Ancestry, thank goodness its not credits as I would have used them all up tonight!!

I'm obviously doing something completely wrong.

I'm looking under WW1 pensions, is that right?

Wish I could pay someone to look it all up for me, its giving me a headache!! Ha Ha!

Thank you again you are being very helpful, patient and kind.

Regards Jennifer

[melliget]

Hi Jennifer.

Welcome. Are you sure about those ship names?

HMS COLOSSUS, a dreadnought battleship that took part in the Battle of Jutland, survived the war and was scrapped in 1928.

HMS EAGLE, an aircraft carrier, was launched 8 June 1918 but was not commissioned until after the war (1924). She was sunk by U-73 in WW2 (1942).

Hopefully, if you've already downloaded the service record from the link provided by Tony, it will clarify which ships he was on.

Regarding the medal for helping to keep the two men afloat, there may be some mention of this also on his service record. Any idea what year it was?

regards,

Martin

[horatio2]

The Fleet Air Arm Museum has his Attestation Pack. See:- http://www.fleetairarm.com/en-GB/royal_nav..._documents.aspx

He was 14, not 11, when he joined the Royal Naval School of Music (RNSM) - born 04/06/1899; enlisted 30/10/1913. RMB/**** numbers were given to musicians serving at the RNSM.

His 1914-15 Star trio of medals were issued to him by the Admiralty and he appears in the RM Medal Roll. Since he was not Army, and served as a RM musician 1913 - 1921, where does the Army MIC and "Pension Record" come into play. Are we sure they are for the right man?

[Jennifersteadman]

Hi Jennifer.

Welcome. Are you sure about those ship names?

HMS COLOSSUS, a dreadnought battleship that took part in the Battle of Jutland, survived the war and was scrapped in 1928.

HMS EAGLE, an aircraft carrier, was launched 8 June 1918 but was not commissioned until after the war (1924). She was sunk by U-73 in WW2 (1942).

Hopefully, if you've already downloaded the service record from the link provided by Tony, it will clarify which ships he was on.

Regarding the medal for helping to keep the two men afloat, there may be some mention of this also on his service record. Any idea what year it was?

regards,

Martin

Hello Martin, Firstly thank you so very, very much for your kind help with my Grandad.

I've looked at the photos of the Colossus and boy, wasnt she a different ship after she had been rigged out with her weaponary? Wow!

From information I have found somewhere else, it appears that the HMS Eagle might have been renamed as the 'Eaglet' after the navy decided that they needed the name for another vessel. Apparently this is common practice?

Regarding his bravery medal, he was invalided out of the Navy in 1921 so I presume that would also be the year for the medal?

Once again, thank you so much My Mum has asked me to pass on her thanks to you all for helping me find her Dads information.

Best regards Jennifer

[horatio2]

Served on two ships HMS Eagle and HMS Collusus. Both ships were torpedoed and after the last ship went down he was awarded a medal for keeping 2 men afloat for 18 hours.

Neither HMS EAGLE nor HMS COLOSSUS were torpedoed or sunk in WW1.

His 'bravery medal' may have been a Royal Humane Society award for saving life but not in the circumstances you assume.

[The Inspector]

Hi Jennifer

I searched using the details you had posted. Correction, the 24 pages relating to Alfred are on the Service records. So that we are looking at the right person can you confirm he had a brother C.Goodyer and a sister Harriet.23 Mowbray Rd, Upper Norwood. Was he demobbed to 53 Barnfield Rd,Plumstead? If the answer is yes then Alfred Goodyer with the numbers you gave was a trumpeter in the 2nd London Bde. RFA which became the 291st Bde.RFA. He signed up on 6.1.15 signature Alf Goodyer as a Driver and on 20.9.15 became a trumpeter. Demobbed on 23.7.19. The records on Ancestry come up out of alphabetical order they are the 21st of 22.

Regards Barry

[per ardua per mare per terram]

Welcome to the forum Jennifer

There seems to be some confusion here that horatio2 has already tried to sort out.

We have 2 seperate people:

Medal card of Goodyer, Alfred

Corps Regiment No Rank

Royal Field Artillery 930581 Driver

He was in the army, records are on Ancestry.

Name Goodyer, Alfred Henry

Register Number: 2170

Division: Royal Marines Band

When Enlisted/Date of Enlistment: 30 October 1913

Date of birth: 04 June 1899

He NOT was in the army, his records are NOT on Ancestry. The Royal Marines were administered by the Admiralty; in general their campaign medals do NOT appear on the army Medal Index Cards online, but are found in the medal rolls for the Royal Marines. Other notable medals that he received should be listed on his service papers. This man's Register of Service (summery) entry can be found using the link provided by Tonyj and his Attestation Pack of papers are held by the Fleet Air Arm museam, not online see post #9 for a link to their research department.

[The Inspector]

Hi All

Obviously the Goodyer on Ancestry is NOT the relation Jennifer was looking for. The one horatio2 posted is. At least we have another satisfied member!!!!

Regards Barry

[per ardua per mare per terram]

... I've looked at the photos of the Colossus and boy, wasnt she a different ship after she had been rigged out with her weaponary? Wow!

From information I have found somewhere else, it appears that the HMS Eagle might have been renamed as the 'Eaglet' after the navy decided that they needed the name for another vessel. Apparently this is common practice?

Regarding his bravery medal, he was invalided out of the Navy in 1921 so I presume that would also be the year for the medal?

...

Pictures of the WWI era His Majesty's Ship Collusus http://www.battleships-cruisers.co.uk/hms_colossus1.htm

HMS Eagle was a 74-gun wooden walled sailing third rate ship launched in 1804 during the Napoleonic War. She was reduced to 50 guns in 1830, later became a training school and the the base for the Royal Naval Reserve unit on Merseyside, and in 1904 also the base for the Mersey Royal Naval Volunteer Reserves. She was renamed Eaglet and was paid off and replaced post WWI. It was is common practice for the Navy to reallocate ships' names while a previous ship is still in existance. Eagle is an apt name for an aircraft carrier so was used. There have been previous threads on this ship, which you can find using the search engine.

If he was awarded a bravery medal and it is not recorded on his service record then it will have to be found using the Admiralty's index ledgers to incoming letters.

[Jennifersteadman]

You guys are simply amazing!!!!

Sadly, Alfred Goodyer who's records were on Ancestry.co.uk is not my late Grandfather, Alfred Henry Goodyer who's records were included on the National aRchives site is!! Hoorah!!

You are really going to laugh. I spent the day printing out the 24 pages on Alfred Goodyer laughing at my Grandads records and his insubordination towards the officers for his swearing at superior officers, then I get to page 19 I think it was andm oh, there's a letter from his brother looking for his whereabouts and Wham!! it hits me that I have been admiring and crying over a completely wrong marine!!

Now, I have printed out the details so kindly supplied to me TonyJ and have now found my Grandad!! Yaaay!! I am delighted!!

Here is the information very kindly summed up by per ardua per mare per terram

Alfred Henry Goodyer

Name Goodyer, Alfred Henry

Register Number: 2170

Division: Royal Marines Band

When Enlisted/Date of Enlistment: 30 October 1913

Date of birth: 04 June 1899

AH Goodyer served on-

HMS King Alfred (I believe that this is a training centre)

Then on another ship that looks like Cormorant? (Not sure about this one.)

Then on HMS Colussus -18th september 1918-31st December 1918

HMS Courageous- 17th Feb 1918-18th March 1918

HMS Tiger- 5th May 1920-17th October 1921 (although the Tiger doesnt appear to have come into service until 1941?)

He was then finally invalided out and discharged on December 7th 1921 after contracting TB and spending some time in isolation.

Inbetween most of these dates he returned back to the Royal Marine school of Music.

Goodness knows how we thought HMS Eagle

It looks as though the only medal he was awarded was the 14-18 Star.

One thing I did find peculiar is under the heading of-

Wounds hurts, special services etc..etc.. it looks as though it says that he was awarded chevrons 1915/ 16/17/18. Are these sergeant stripes or medal ribbons?

Guys, I am so extrememly grateful for all of your help so far. I intend to write to the Fleet air arm museum to request a copy of his attestation pack.

I presume that the medals my Cousin has that belonged to my Grandad must be campaign medals. I'm going to try and find out exactly what they were and get some minature replicas for my Mum to wear.

I sincerely hope that oneday, I will be as helpful to someone on here as you have been to me.

I cannot wait to find out more and more about my Grandfather AH Goodyer. He sounds like he really was an amazing man and I only wish I could have met him.

Now, anyone know about Victorian high wire walkers, I'm off to look at my Mums Grandad now!! Ha Ha!!

Many, many thanks again,

Regards Jennifer

[melliget]

Jennifer.

Funny about that, thinking that that other man, insubordination and all, was your man You have to be careful, don't you.

HMS KING ALFRED, armoured cruiser (14150 tons), may have been one of the ships your grandfather was torpedoed on. According to uboat.net, it was torpedoed by German submarine UB-86 thirty miles North of Malin Head on 11 Apr 1918. It wasn't sunk, however, just damaged and was eventually brought safely into the Mersey.

I don't know whether it was requisitioned by the Admiralty or not but I did notice a reference to a Grimsby trawler named KING ALFRED being sunk in the North Sea in February 1917.

These two WW1 ships may have been those your grandfather served on:

HMS COURAGEOUS

HMS TIGER

regards,

Martin

p.s. Just as an aside (this is a little after your grandfather's time, of course), the Band of H.M. Royal Marines (The Royal Yacht Band) accompanied the newly-crowned Queen Elizabeth II and the Duke of Edinburgh on their Royal visit to Australia in 1954. Apart from an official concert at Melbourne Town Hall (for which I have the official programme), the bandsmen attended an unofficial party at my aunt's place (my Dad was a naval musician in the RAN). I imagine the dance music emanating from her small inner suburban house must have sounded pretty good.

[Jennifersteadman]

Thank you so much for this wonderful information. Just goes to prove that if you know what you are doing, you can find the correct information! You find the correct ship and I find a building called the King Alfred!?

That is very interesting that the King alfred was torpedoed, but not sunk.

I have to admit to finding the RM band music very uplifting and filled with fighting spirit which is after all, what the band was all about.

I think I'm right, but my research has led me to believe that the chevrons he was awarded are in recognition of injuries received. I'm now working on finding his medal records.

Many thanks again, this is very addictive isnt it?

Regards Jennifer

[horatio2]

His medal entitlement is recorded in the RM Medal Roll - ADM 171/168/449 at Kew and not on-line.

His entry states, as I noted in Post #9 above, that he was awarded 1914-15 Star, Britsh War and Victory medals. The Star was issued to him in HMS TIGER; the other two were issued to him after discharge.

A chevron was issued for service in each of the war years - not for wounds.

It is the Royal Naval (not Marines) School of Music.

[per ardua per mare per terram]

Pictures http://www.battleships-cruisers.co.uk/drak...20King%20Alfred

http://www.battleships-cruisers.co.uk/tiger.htm

http://www.battleships-cruisers.co.uk/hms_courageous.htm

[Jennifersteadman]

To Horatio2 and to per ardua per mare per terram,

I extremely grateful to you for all of your help.

I am fascinated to find out all this information about my Grandad, but also that I have found out so much about the lads who fought in this terrible war.

I doubt that I can be, but if I can ever be of any help to any of you, I will be delighted to do so.

I'm going to start looking for my Dads family now and I know that his Grandad was invloved in the Second Boer war, siege of Mafeking. I have a feeling that this will be a little harder to access information.

Many thanks again, I am sincerely appreciative for everything.

Regards Jennifer