Troops strike at Kantara IBD

[ddycher]

All

Does anyone have any information on the strike by troops at the IBD at Kantara in April 1919.

I am tracking the disbandment demobilisation of a number of units through this time. I have numerous ref's to it happening but little detail. I know it was due to the temporary halt of demobilisation to deal with the local riots but does anybody have more detail ? I understand events started on 3rd April and lasted until the 27th April.

What I have as follows :

1. First complaints made by the troops (which troops ?) on the 3rd April.

2. On the 5th April there was a large demonstration with around some 800 men involved.

3. Leaders of the strike (not mutiny ?)met with the Camp Commandant on the 8th April.

4. When nothing had been resolved by the 20th April the troops went on strike which lasted for a week until fresh troops were despatched to Kantara and demobilisation resumed on the 27th.

I understand the leaders name was McCarthy but know no more about him that that.

Dave Lamb (http://libcom.org/library/mutinies-dave-lamb-solidarity) states "Mass meetings were held by soldiers serving in Kantara, Egypt, during which two men from each unit were elected to form a Central Committee. The Committee's task was to put forward the various grievances of the men, but it seemingly confined itself to what the press described as 'legal activities'".

Anybody know more about the events or the people involved ?

Regards

Dave

[David Porter]

Dave,

I cannot help you much but I too would like to know more.

The 18th Bde. RHA were at Kantara from 27th March and were posted on railway patrol on 17th April.

The only other thing of note in the meantime is that 14 ORs went for instruction in motor driving & repair on 16th April.

They patroled the railway line between Ferdan and Port Said until at least 9th May having relieved 75th Divisional Artillery. Many of them had not had leave for 3 years, so if they were involved in the strike I would certainly like to know.

The cadre of 18th Bde. RHA finally left Port Said on 30th May.

There were some disturbances in the February as this Hansard entry states:

KANTARA CAMP, EGYPT.HC Deb 30 April 1919 vol 115 cc163-4W

Mr. GWYNNE asked the Secretary of State for War whether there were any casualties in the riot at Kantara Camp, Egypt; and, if so, how many?

Mr. CHURCHILL I am informed that there was some unrest in the camp last February caused by doubts in connection with the bonus and the uncertain prospects of release, but I have no knowledge of any riot or casualties.

[michaeldr]

Quotes from Dave – 'Does anyone have any information on the strike by troops at the IBD at Kantara in April 1919'

&… 'First complaints made by the troops (which troops ?) on the 3rd April'

As David P. indicates above, the unrest commenced in February 1919

See Allenby to War Office, 20 Feb 1919, text here

At Kantara the trouble seems to have started with the RAOC and on 4 May 1919 Allenby was again writing to the War Office: "Your No. 77525,S.D.2, is not adequate to the situation here. If you cannot make more satisfactory arrangements to enable my troops to be demobilized and to go on leave I must warn you that, owing to the present temper of the troops, I expect serious trouble to ensue very shortly."

Here, Allenby continues in some detail regarding what he sees as his requirements, including a further possible reference to the ROAC (?) - "I must again bring to your notice the urgent necessity of sending reinforcements for technical units; the men of these units are often connected with trade unions and are liable to cause mutinous conduct among neighbouring troops. Reinforcements for the Imperial Camel Corps not being procurable, I shall replace them partly by light-armoured car patrols; for this purpose I require ample machine-gun motor personnel. I hope to reduce numbers of British in mechanical transport by training more Egyptians and by employing more civilians to reduce the numbers in the Ordnance service."

As with the above link, details here taken from 'Allenby in Palestine – the Middle East correspondence of Field Marshal

Viscount Allenby' selected & edited by Matthew Hughes, ARS & Sutton Publishing, 2004

regards

Michael

[michaeldr]

Reading Hughes' book further, Allenby wasted no time in pressing his points again and again

see Allenby to Churchill 9 May 1919, MFA 37618

"See my No. MFA 37593, 8 May, and No. MFA 37617, 9 May. There is a growing danger of unrest amongst demobilizable men of the Egyptian Expeditionary Force, and it is of the utmost importance that every pledge made by the War Office should be fulfilled."

In his notes Hughes explains that 'The men were especially worried about losing jobs at home that had been held open for them by employers.'

Allenby was once more pressing the War Office on 16 May 1919 [Dave, I think that you have this, so I will not go into details, except to draw your attention to] "The situation is most acute in all parts of my force. If above request is not favourably received I expect a refusal to work on the part of the Administrative Services and I fear that this will spread to combatant units amongst whom, as you know, there is all ready unrest. I am convinced that these demands should be met in order to obviate mutiny on a large scale, which will have a serious effect on my Indian troops and on French and Italian feelings and on population generally. Consequently, I have decided to risk the grave danger of weak forces and to send these men home whether you can supply reinforcements or not."

[michaeldr]

question - "a refusal to work on the part of the Administrative Services and I fear that this will spread to combatant units"

Is Allenby's use of the expression Administrative Services (and its contrast with 'combatant units') a further ref to the RAOC (etc)?

Allenby again uses this form of words in his letter to Wilson of 17 May 1919

'There is great unrest and discontent in my army; and, in the case of the administrative services, unrest verges on mutiny.'

[ddycher]

Michael / David

Thanks for this. Still trying to determine which units were involved - surprisingly little detail that I can find so far.

David's ref to Hansard gave me a few other pointers which made ref to Homeward Camp at Kantara and the signal section men of the Army Postal Service. It also cites that the call for volunteers for the army of occupation in Egypt was a total failure. There is also ref's made to the 75th divisional signal company (which is much closer to my area of interest). A further ref cites the attitude of the officer commanding the 3rd Echelon at Kantara being a cause of some friction - will look into this one further.

There is also the following "that soldiers' councils have been instituted among the troops in Egypt; that at Kantara such bodies decide what guards and fatigues are necessary; that the Ordnance Corps at Cairo struck on the 12th instant and an ammunition dump was fired that evening; is he aware that a mass meeting of the troops was held on the 13th May in Cairo to protest against the compulsory retention of men who volunteered for military service; that a general strike of the men serving in Egypt is threatened; and will he do his utmost to allay the unrest by speeding up demobilisation?" - showing hat these disturbances spread further afield than Kantara.

Michael with respect to the RAOC there is a ref to men serving 25 months without leave who had been told they would not be entitled until they had reached 30 months.

Interesting - will keep looking.

Regards

Dave

[AndyR]

Dave et al,

You may be interested in the following extracts from the diary of William Knott held by National Archives - doesn't really help answer the questions you asked - but interesting none the less!

Thurs Apr 3rd – The troops here are getting very restless and are wanting to know the exact position of things. – News of Mr Churchill’s infamous lie in the House is through namely that every man volunteered to stop whereas it was all compulsory; voluntary service not even asked for. All this goes to stir up discontent among the troops, who have been fooled for long enough.

Sat Apr 5th – To-night there was a mass meeting of some 800 men who are protesting against the treatment of soldiers in the E.E.F. The chief grievances are:-

1. No reasons given for not being demobilized, also protest against Winston Churchill’s infamous lie.

2. Better conditions in camp, up till now food has been scarce and oftentimes the little issued unconsumable. Needless parades and undue exposure to the sun, etc.

3. The seclusion of all news from troops.

In the latter two cases things have already improved, news sheets posted daily and foods improved in quantity & quality. It just shows that there has been due cause for complaints and slackness on the orderly room’s part and evil scheming in the quarter masters stores has been rampant.

As to the first no satisfactory answer was given so a demand that the reason should be sought for from the higher power was made.

Tues Apr 8th – The meeting last night on the part of the agitators proved highly satisfactory. The chief leader of the movement after a great deal of trouble had obtained a further interview with the C.O. and this time was given every encouragement to ‘carry on’. In fact, the Colonel went so far as to endorse a written statement, giving reasons for the disturbance and unattended petitions of the last meeting. The Kantara zone G.O.C. was then given full particulars, and surprised all by sanctioning the statements for forwarding to General-in-Command E.E.F. and personally send a letter demanding a public apology by Mr W Churchill for his indiscrete statement.

Thurs Apr 17th – There has been little to record since the above date, as throughout the period we have been hanging on at the demob’ camp waiting for the word to embark, but the gyppos will not settle down yet. The nationalist party have sent a delegation to Paris but will not obtain their demands. England, America and France are combined in their idea that Egypt is not yet fit for self-government and is proving so more day by day.

Unfortunately some 50 British soldiers have been killed in the riots while the native casualties amount to over 1000.

The latest developments reveal a general strike on the railways. So things do not yet look very hopeful for being homeward bound.

Sat Apr 19th – This morning we were lined up and detailed in sections of tens being told we would be known as the emergency railway company in case the military took over the E.S.R. Thus our hopes of going home seem as forlorn as ever.

Sun Apr 20th – Easter Sunday! It is hard to realise the fact but it is so!

In the camp all is unrest, a revolting spirit is about and at 1 o’clock a mass meeting was called, and delegates one per section volunteered to appear before the C.O. on behalf of the men. Their demands are immediate release, on the grounds of not being required and uneligible men going in preference to we who have been here for five and six weeks. If suitable concessions are made before Tuesday, all’s well, but after that no work is to be done.

I thank God, I can see beyond the mist of unsettlement, and join in the praises of the mighty triumph over death – my Saviour’s resurrection. The proof of the satisfaction of the claims of God’s Throne of the sacrifice. Thus the way of Salvation is open to all who believe.

It is apparent that the authorities have got to know of the meeting for at 5 o’clock every man was warned for an emergency railway excursion to proceed to Zagazig, Tantah or Cairo. As the order was only cancelled yesterday it is apparent this move has been done to break up the agitation. An event then followed the parallel of which I should not think has been known in the army.

The whole camp walked off parade and massed on the football field formed up in fours and paraded before the C.O. presenting their demands.

The Colonel tried to appeal but having insufficient grounds could not impress the men. There was no reason given for sending us away, no guarantee of reinforcements and no satisfactory answer as to unfairness of the selection of the last draft.

G.O.C. Kantara was at once sent for, and after interviewing the delegates promised to see into the matter.

Mon Apr 21st – The dawn appeared but no reveille at 4 a.m. to prepare for the journey. Then notices for 7.30 were posted, but after breakfast at 8 o’clock the 2000 odd men in the camp gathered to decide upon what course to take.

After many speeches, good & otherwise, we decided to ‘down tools’ until satisfactory answers were given. No guards, fatigues were to be done save those essential such as fetching rations and cooking same. If anyone was arrested the whole band will demand his immediate release.

Before the gathering had concluded, the camp officials sent a request that we would allow General Peerless a hearing! What a change!! All marched in fours orderly and formed up to hear what he had to say.

No satisfaction was given he spoke of being 26 years a soldier and never seeing such an uprising. Then exaggerating the situation in Egypt, appeal to the human side but with no effect save to make the men more determined after being doped so many times with flowery talk, the authorities must give definite satisfaction this time.

The General left almost weeping, not in sympathy so much as unsuppress angry and of probable loss of present post.

Afternoon brought another officer General Lloyd, who besought an audience! This time most of the staff join us, some 500 strong.

This man tried sly pitiful speech, attempting to play on their feeling yet saying he was on the men’s side every time! He spoke of the splendid men who was working along the line, some cut to pieces etc. Then tried assurances of reinforcements but did not know where they were.

In the finish, as a last course he promised to go and se General Allenby. As there were no trains he went by aeroplane so it’s apparent Tommy’s words are counting this time.

For four and a half years men have bourne insult, submitted to discipline and doggedly endured red tape. But now militarism is broken and crushed, we must fight its further existence in our own land.

Thus Easter Monday is spent in KANTARA.

Tues Apr 22nd – Another meeting this morning largely commenting on yesterdays speeches, getting volunteers for cook-house work, etc. Also what attitude to take if General Allenby comes to speak.

The astounding figures for army of occupation were read, Britain 176,000, Ireland 44,000, France 120,000, Germany 264,000, Russia 20,000, Mesopot. 30,000, India & the East 60,000 and Egypt, Caucasus & Near East 75,000. The latterly totally inadequate.

A voluntary guard was posted over 6,000,000 rounds of ammunition, to prevent stealing by Egyptians, so the authorities have no loop-hole by which we can denounced as inciting mutiny, which is farthest from the thoughts of any one.

It is the only way to get back to Blighty and hurry out reinforcements.

Wed Apr 23rd – The camp is still at a standstill and men again gather at 8 a.m. to know how things are developing. It appears that all units outside this camp are in sympathy and ready to assist us at any time should occasion arise.

The determination of the men is strengthened by reports of the Military Service act calling for so great an army, so contrasting to the cry for less armaments and league of nations, etc.

Already some 200 men have come back to camp so it’s appears the authorities are taking some notice of our demands.

The staff of the camp endeavour daily to entice men to do guards etc., but of no avail, the only answer they got is ‘Our only parade is at 8 on the football field.’

Thurs Apr 24th – One cannot help but see the humorous side of this question and situation. A few days back men were rushing about at the orders of N.C.O’s, guards and piquets were numerous, a lot unnecessary, everything carried out in army routine style – but now men go and return as they please, the staff stand and gaze helplessly, no guards or piquets are posted yet the camp is keep clean and food cooked.

We are just waiting General Allenby’s answer; another bit of news is a new G.R.O. has been issued stating all men of R.A.M.C., R.A.S.C., R.A.O.C and other administrative units are to be returned by units. Although not affecting us it is hard luck on the boys left behind of nearly 4 years overseas service.

Sat Apr 26th – At the meeting, this morning General Lloyd’s message was read after his return from Cairo. But the answer was neither yes or no to our demands but an assurance that reinforcements were on the way and demobilization would start when these arrived. We have heard these idle promises before but they are not good enough this time.

The afternoon was spent swimming and watching cricket.

Sun Apr 27th – At the meeting this morning the strike was declared finished and thanks to the abilities of the leader, McCarthy has been brought to a successful finish. So the whole marched back on to the parade ground presenting themselves for duty! Though the authorities have not come on bended knees (none expected them to) yet their assurances are almost immediate despatch of troops.

Mon Apr 28th – We are now all waiting patiently for a home draft to be called out and be away to those we love.

Tues Apr 29th – Heard today of a draft being called tomorrow morning so am hoping to be included on same!

Wed Apr 30th – All were expectant at 6.30 a.m. this morning and at last I am one of the fortunates. We were parading most of the day for medical inspection, check roll-calls, pay and lastly to hand in our blankets leaving us with one seeing our route was via Marseilles. At night I had time to send a wire to Dad at Alex who will be overjoyed to know of the good news.

Regards

AndyR

[ddycher]

Andy

Brilliant - thanks very much. This exactly what I was looking for.

Regards

Dave

[ddycher]

All

Have been trying (albeit not very successfully) to get a better picture of life at Homeward Camp, Kantara - this being the primary demob camp - for the first half of 1919.

Going into this further demobilsation in general seems to have been a huge "bone of contention" for the EEF. Have no sense of how this compared to the Western Front but the more I look into local events at Kantara at the time the more ref's I find to discontentment throughout the EEF wrt demobilisation.

Came across another ref today in Jstor on demobilistion of medical staff. This again states demobilisation ground to a halt between May and atleast August of 1919. Again trouble centres on men queued for release being held pending relief from the UK. This seems to have proven almost impossible.

This takes me back to an earlier comment re difficulties in staffing the army of occupation for Palestine and Syria. Whilst the government seems to have painted a fairly positive picture of staffing up the occupation forces everything I am reading from the men themselves reflects the exact opposite. Irrespective which aspect of the service I look at there appear to have been troubles / concerns.

Trying to seperate the needs of the Army of Occupation against the immediate concerns with the Egyptian 1919 "Revolution" is also proving difficult. Am starting to sense that the local troubles were stressed as a reason for slowing down demobilisation as drafts from home were proving exceedingly difficult to come by. As I understand it at the moment local insurrection was limited to Cairo, the provincial cities of Lower Egypt and in Asyut Province in Upper Egypt.

Does anyone have any sense on what the drafts from the UK looked like for the EEF Army of Occupation ? Was this primarily made up from the Young Soldier Battalions similar to those sent to Germany ?

Tracking the demobilization process has also helped a little put these events into perspective. Demob timelines as I now understand it as follows :

1. Initial scheme presented to troops in Jan '19

2. Modifications were issues to Bn CO's first week in Feb '19

3. Significant numbers are men were sent to Kantara for demob from the middle of Feb '19

4. Many of the combat Bn's were down to approx half strength by end of Feb '19

5. Demob drafts were continued in March

6. Demob suspended in April due to disturbances.

7. Demob restarted in May.

8. By end of June most combat Bn's assigned for demob were down to cadre's.

During this time many Bn's went through restructuring to form Demob and Army of Occupation Coy's prior to the Bn's diminishing to the point of cadre's and their final despatch home.

Anybody have any further insights ?

Regards

Dave