Need info on Richard & Henry Owen from Talwrn Anglesey

[widavies]

Will,

That's certainly an odd coincidence - one Special Reservist and the other a recalled Regular Reservist, from different families and areas of North Wales and yet unknowingly later to become related to you. And both apparently killed with the same battalion on the same day. If they were in the same company they might well have known each other, otherwise the relationship would be a bit vaguer (they didn't arrive in France at the same time, there were lots of reinforcements in the same boat as them trying to find their feet in a new unit, and over 800 men in the battalion).

I have been thinking about Richard, and am going to hazard that he was indeed a Festubert casualty of the period 16-18 May. His papers do not have the usual note of his being killed or missing in action - instead it is another formation, 153rd Brigade of the 51st (Highland) Division who find and identify the body, give it burial, and report the same to the authorities on 28 May. The 51st also took part in the Festubert & 2nd Givenchy fighting so were in the right area.

Somehow no note of his being a casualty of any sort had arrived until then. Whether the 1st RWF were in such a poor shape after the action that they didn't submit a comprehensive list of killed, wounded and missing I'm not sure - maybe the War Diary refers to this? I have come across casualties being reported (and it's usually the date of first report that's used, not the date the event occurred) quite a long time after an action, owing to disorganisation. How does the reporting of Joseph Davies' death compare? The RWF did recover 100-plus bodies before the 18 May, and maybe these were reported quicker than the remaining missing.

However, only one Identity Disc was issued to soldiers at that period of the War, and the main aim seems to have been to recover this item and/or a paybook as proof of death. The bodies were frequently left lying where found (if in an active No Mans Land), or given a hasty burial in say a shell hole, but the disc was taken back, rendering the corpse fairly anonymous. This meant that subsequently, when any temporary grave markers disappeared, there was no trace of the burials - and even if found again the bodies were often unidentifiable. So Richard's body despite being recorded as being buried couldn't be located/identified after the War, leading to his name being engraved at Le Touret. Joseph's likewise - if missing on his forms, he may never have been recovered as an identifiable body in the first place, his death being presumed at a later date to have taken place on 16 May.

I didn't take shots of all the RWF names at Le Touret, only the Anglesey ones, so wasn't looking for J.Davies then. You could however get pictures of the panel by starting a new thread (under Cemeteries & Memorials, or Photos Requested) asking for this - there are individuals and groups who undertake photography of the memorials on a large scale and are represented on this Forum.

Hwyl,

Clive

Hi Clive,

I have Josephs papers clearly showing he was KIA on 16th see below:-

Joseph Davies KIA 16^th May 1915. 1^st Btn RWF. No 11069.

SDGW for Joseph shows born and reside Abergele, enlisted Rhyl. Killed in Action (as opposed to died of wounds or died)

Enlisted late 1912 early 1913 I should think (but would need verifying)

His records do not seem to have survived. That shows entered France 11/12/1914 and the Diary shows 3 officers and 40 Other Ranks joining for duty on 17/12/1914. His medal card is attached.

An interesting twist of fate if prooved true, so it may be that Joseph was one of the first 100 recovered originally after the initial assault and that maybe my other great Uncle was one of the remaining casualties not reported as dead until later.

Regards

Will Davies