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DCM and Bar


27thBN
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Could please get the amount of DCM bars awarded please for WW1. I had number given to me before but did not seem high enough .just want a second opinion

Thanks

MC

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Does the figure appear in Recipients of the Distinguished Conduct Medal 1914-1920 by Robert Walker?

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It certainly appears in British Gallantry Awards by Abbott and Tamplin and I think in the Statistics of the Allied Effort in the Great War

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Does the figure appear in Recipients of the Distinguished Conduct Medal 1914-1920 by Robert Walker?

Yes this is the book I heard that the stats were in .The number another told me was 472 DCM bars but i would have thought that it was higher than that .Does anyone have a copy to look up again

Thanks MC

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According to the book mentioned (Walker) it states 490 bars and 10 second bars. There is also a second bar awarded to a Belgian soldier. Hope this helps.

Cheers,

David

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Ok well thats great i had 472 and the book 490 so not to much difference thanks for looking it up for me maybe you might need a coronation or jubilee lookup I have most of the rolls from 1935 to 1977

Thanks MC

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Hi MC,

no problems. Glad to help and thanks for your offer of lookups ;) . This is what it's all about - helping and sharing of information.

Cheers,

David

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Yes too true, Anyway i have a listing in the reference section if you need anything looked up at a latter time please do so

Thanks MC

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Ok well thats great i had 472 and the book 490

The discrepancy can probably accounted for by Walker listing 19 bars to pre WWI awards. 472 1st bars (including one to a Belgian) plus 19 1st bars to previous awards give 491: Walker's total.

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The discrepancy can probably accounted for by Walker listing 19 bars to pre WWI awards. 472 1st bars (including one to a Belgian) plus 19 1st bars to previous awards give 491: Walker's total.

Thanks for that so both numbers i got are correct depending on exactly how you are counting them .Still not many I wonder how many are left??? :unsure::unsure:

I just got a new group and wanted to know.As to your comment the other day i did i check and well and truly find out what an artificer

does A qualified Mechanic in both army ,navy and else were.

Thanks MC

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I had number given to me before but did not seem high enough.

One of the limiting factors for the DCM was that each award brought a gratuity. Another was that many in the army considered promotion as valid as a decoration in rewarding for gallentry, especially in the first years of the war. So the high number of rankers being commissioned reduced the pool available for bars to the DCM.

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One of the limiting factors for the DCM was that each award brought a gratuity. Another was that many in the army considered promotion as valid as a decoration in rewarding for gallentry, especially in the first years of the war. So the high number of rankers being commissioned reduced the pool available for bars to the DCM.

I was always aware of officers getting a brevet in lieu of a decoration ,but never thought about similar for enlisted men re the being commissioned from the ranks .I for one never would have thought for a moment that you could as such put a price on bravery ie a promotion instead of an award .Money/promotion was effectively as good as a gallantry medal when it came down to it .Also did each extra DCM get a gratuity .. would have been very nice indeed

MC

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Gallantry was one of the routes for being commissioned from the ranks for over 100 years; as fictionalised in the Sharpe novels. In the time of purchase of commissions it was a way for both officers so promoted and the less wealthy to rise up the ranks. An example was Major General Sir Luke O'Connor who was commissioned following his bravery in the Crimea and later received subsequent promotions for gallantry in the Indian Mutiny and Ashanti War, if I remember correctly.

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Well I have certainly appreciated the comments,and info ,as they say you learn something new everyday .Does make sense re being promoted from the ranks by a gallant deed.You wonder as per your comment of the gratuity.That money comes into it so how many men who got a commission did so instead of a gallantry award and how it was discussed .I mean in a discussion " well how about a DCM or as you have been a great say Cpl we will give you a commission your choice" is this likely at all to really have happened ,was money that an important issue in the award system during the war.

Thanks MC

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I doubt that there would often be a discussion with a man what reward he would get! As for money being a factor in the considerations, impossible to say, but I think it may have been in the mind of some pre war officers.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Just as an after thought to the thread just received my copy of the book by R W Walker great info a nice good read with pictures for the first few pages until you get to the listings overall excellent book

MC

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DCM 1st Bars-

France

1914 0

1915 15

1916 60

1917 61

1918 192

1919 102

Gallipoli

1916 1

Mesopotamia

1916 6

1917 8

1918 1

1919 2

Egypt

1917 1

1918 4

1919 5

East Africa

1916 1

1918 1

Italy

1918 4

1919 1

Russia (all commands)

1919 2

1920 3

Miscellaneous

1915-1920 2

Which is 472

M

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Nice bit of work there I have cut and pasted into my research documents

Thanks MC

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MC,

There is a volume called "Official Statistics - being the Effort of the British Empire during the Great War" which I have a facsimile of.

Reading the telephone directory for London is more stimulating, but it does have a huge number of tables of sometimes trivial, but sometimes useful, information.

There is a similar list for all Medals and Decorations, including New Years Hons and Military OBE's etc.,

There is also the detail of how many pairs of socks were issued by the Army during the period 1st August 1914 and week ending 2nd June 1919.

It was 122,437,525 pairs (worsted) to go with 40,020,074 pairs of boots (ankle).

So that's 22,687.12 pairs of-boots and 69,409.28 pairs of socks per day.

Now you know.

M

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Some more..............

MM bars 1 2 3

France and Flanders

1916 175

1917 1216 18

1918 1788 60

1919 2527 102 1

1920 12

Balkans

1918 2

Egypt

1918 8

1919 4

East Africa

1919 1

Italy

1918 23

1919 15

Russia (all commands)

1919 5

1920 9

Miscellaneous

1915-1920 11

Totals 5796 180 3

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  • 7 months later...
Some more..............

MM bars 1 2 3

France and Flanders

1916 175

1917 1216 18

1918 1788 60

1919 2527 102 1

1920 12

Balkans

1918 2

Egypt

1918 8

1919 4

East Africa

1919 1

Italy

1918 23

1919 15

Russia (all commands)

1919 5

1920 9

Miscellaneous

1915-1920 11

Totals 5796 180 3

Sir, Can I please ask where this information cam from? As I've listed 5600 first bars and 178 two bars. Please note the two bars and three bars are not included in the first bar total. So I make a total of 5785 first bars.

Regards

Ray

medal-mounting@hotmail.co.uk

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27thBN said:
Nice bit of work there I have cut and pasted into my research documents

Thanks MC

 

may be of interest, Canadian DCM & 2 Bars , said to be the only Canadain awarded DCM & 2 Bars WW!

Bob R.

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Sir, Can I please ask where this information cam from? As I've listed 5600 first bars and 178 two bars. Please note the two bars and three bars are not included in the first bar total. So I make a total of 5785 first bars.

Tephrite mentioned "Official Statistics - being the Effort of the British Empire during the Great War" in post # 19.

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post-9-075372000 1278868443.jpg

I am aware that a 2nd Bar to a MM was issused to a West Yorkshire Man whilst in Italy. This does not show on the records above, how accurate are these???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

Regards as alwas Kevin

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