joflint Posted 30 July , 2009 Share Posted 30 July , 2009 A member of my family (a gunner in the 138th Heavy Branch RA) was awarded a MSM. Can anyone tell me where i might find out more about why he received it. I've looked at the 'Hampstead Heavies' website but that doesn't tell me. I am also confused as he was (i think) demobilised in March 1919 and the paperwprk for the award is Nov 1919?! Is there an obvious reason these dates don't tally? All and any information received with thanks Jo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David B Posted 30 July , 2009 Share Posted 30 July , 2009 Dont worry about the apparent discrepancy of dates Jo, my grandfather was demobbed in March 1919 and received his MSM in 1941. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Droocoo Posted 31 July , 2009 Share Posted 31 July , 2009 Remember that also many MSM and MM's records were destroyed in the London blitz. Your chances of finding out the citation are almost nil. Sorry to get your hopes down Posting this on the British Medal forum will also help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshdoc Posted 31 July , 2009 Share Posted 31 July , 2009 There were 2 types of MSM, one the immediate was awarded during the war and I guess the 1919 would be one of them. These can be found in the London gazette but there will not be citation. These were for " exeptionally valuable or meritorious services". The other type were for meritorous service over a long period, these were for senior NCos and were limited in number as they came with an anual pension. Some later awards were given without the pension. http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/307...upplements/7145 http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/307...upplements/7133 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffsyeoman Posted 31 July , 2009 Share Posted 31 July , 2009 A minor amplification... some MSMs were awarded "For Gallantry in the performance of military duty" - acts of bravery not in the face of the enemy. Preventing grenade accidents in training, at events like train crashes; members of the Warwickshire Yeomanry got 'gallantry' MSMs for saving their comrades - and horses - from a torpedoed troopship. IIRC this provision was made to mitigate the numbers of MMs awarded for actions not in the front line. However, Gallantry MSMs (which are marked as such in the Gazette, usually by a bracket (GALLANTRY) ) are much more scarce than the good service ones. The late award MSMs are a slightly different beast; an Army Order of 1951 retrospectively awarded the MSM (George VI Coinage Head 2nd Type) to long-service soldiers it was felt had merited an award above and LSGC, but did not meet the criteria. This went back to the early years of the century, so with no service after WW1, you see a George VI MSM on the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
per ardua per mare per terram Posted 31 July , 2009 Share Posted 31 July , 2009 A member of my family (a gunner in the 138th Heavy Branch RA) was awarded a MSM. I am also confused as he was (i think) demobilised in March 1919 and the paperwprk for the award is Nov 1919?! Is there an obvious reason these dates don't tally? After WWI there was a period where awards were still being awarded even though men had been discharged; the awards committies took the time to go through details and were able to reflect on additional awards. The last VC for WWI was awarded in 1920. Don't forget that the peace treaty was not signed until after your man had been discharged! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rflory Posted 31 July , 2009 Share Posted 31 July , 2009 293092 Gunner F Epps, RGA received an immediate award of the Meritorious Service Medal in the London Gazette of 17 June 1918, page 7145 'in recognition of valuable services rendered with the Forces in France." The form that you illustrated in your initial posting is the receipt for the award. 138th Heavy Battery, RGA was known as the Hempstead Heavies and there is a very good website on this battery and its activities during the Great War at: http://homepages.tesco.net/~johnridler/index.html. Regards, Dick Flory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshdoc Posted 31 July , 2009 Share Posted 31 July , 2009 see post 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joflint Posted 1 August , 2009 Author Share Posted 1 August , 2009 Brilliant thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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