Muerrisch Posted 20 June , 2009 Share Posted 20 June , 2009 The anniversary looms: 2nd RWF fought an heroic action under desperate circumstances at Givenchy-les-la-Bassee and evicted the Germans after surviving a huge mine. The crater can be discerned on Google Earth. The following did not survive. [commemorations or graves appended] RIP. Bale. James William Sgt 9339 Gorre British II A 6 Bayliss. Alfred William Pte 31199 Gorre British II A 23 Bloor. Arthur Pte 23938 Gorre British II A 4 Carter. John missing Pte 8931 Loos Mem Chatwin. William Pte 9181 Cabaret Rouge XVII F 15 Clarke. Henry Pte 12220 Gorre British II A 2 Clarke. Richard Thomas Pte 11115 Gorre British II B Coll. grave 3A Davies. Thomas John Pte 4474 Loos Mem Davies. William LCpl 37119 Loos Mem Deeming. George Pte 9542 Loos Mem Derry. Horace Pte 36329 Loos Mem Edson. George Pte 19624 Loos Mem Edwards. William Pte 5484 Loos Mem Ensor. Harry Pte 9025 Gorre British II A 5 Evans. Evan James Pte 6360 Loos Mem Evans. James Cpl 7065 Loos Mem Faulkner. Frederick T Pte 6395 Loos Mem Fradley. Joseph Pte 36417 Loos Mem Heath. Alfred Henry Pte 8630 Loos Mem Hopley. John Thomas Pte 36673 Gorre British II A 7 Hughes. Edward Cpl 8398 Loos Mem Hughes. William Robert Pte 10117 Cabaret Rouge XVI H 19 Hutchins. Alfred Pte 5511 Loos Mem Jones. Evan Morgan Pte 8556 Pont du Hem VI H 24 Langton. Albert Edward Pte 9035 Loos Mem Lewis. David Pte 11280 Loos Mem Mahoney. Walter Pte 9510 Loos Mem Mc Laughlin. Laurence T Pte 12890 Loos Mem Morris. Evan Lloyd LCpl 6053 Gorre British II A 9 Nesmith. Archibald Pte 8682 Loos Mem Parry. William Pte 9631 Loos Mem Pattison. Peter CSM 8731 Loos Mem Paul. E Pte 24159 Gorre British II A 10 Perry. George Pte 36475 Loos Mem Plumbley. Harold Pte 17926 Gorre British II A 3 Potts. William Pte 23960 Rue Petillon Mil II E 8 Price. Bert Pte 9204 Cabaret Rouge XVII E 30 Pyatt. John William LCpl 9536 Gorre British II A 14 Roberts. David Pte 37093 Gorre British II A 12 Roberts. Ellis Pte 12821 Loos Mem Salt. Bertram Thomas Pte 23888 Loos Mem Samuel. Charles H Pte 36721 Loos Mem Sephton. James Pte 36294 22/06/1916 Gorre British II A 13 Stait. Albert Pte 8911 Gorre British II A 8 Tinley. Frank Pte 6020 Loos Mem Vale. Frederick Pte 9690 Cabaret Rouge XVII E 28 Walker. Samuel Pte 8457 Loos Mem Webb. John Joseph LCpl 36715 Loos Mem White. James Pte 8514 Loos Mem Williams. Thomas LCpl 11146 Cabaret Rouge XVII E 29 Wyllie. James Pte 5317 Cabaret Rouge XVII E 31 Young George Edwin Pte 9514 Gorre British II A 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muerrisch Posted 21 June , 2009 Author Share Posted 21 June , 2009 Surprised and disappointed not to have attracted any reply. Anniversary is tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cockney tone Posted 21 June , 2009 Share Posted 21 June , 2009 Grumpy, Remembering them. thank you for the freedom that I enjoy RIP Scottie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigelcave Posted 21 June , 2009 Share Posted 21 June , 2009 Don't worry - a favoured memory of locating this crater many years ago; in memory of their heroism. And then the surprise of finding the Earl of Coventry (Worcesters, WWII) and a Red Army soldier in the nearby communal cemetery. How did the latter get there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Hesketh Posted 21 June , 2009 Share Posted 21 June , 2009 A couple of men from Abergele experienced this and thankfully survived it. Many were less fortunate and your listing reminds us of the terrible cost of what must have been a horrific experience. With respect may I also add the name of a man from a neighbouring village to Abergele that you have missed off. Name: BANKS, ARTHUR CHAPLIN Initials: A C Nationality: United Kingdom Rank: Second Lieutenant Regiment/Service: Royal Welsh Fusiliers Unit Text: 2nd Bn. Age: 20 Date of Death: 22/06/1916 Additional information: Son of Mr. C. P. and Helen Agnes Banks, of Arnold House, Llanddulas, Denbighshire. Native of Kendal, Westmorland. Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead Grave/Memorial Reference: II. A. 1. Cemetery: GORRE BRITISH AND INDIAN CEMETERY Died from being stabbed in the stomach following a hand to hand fight with a German soldier. It was his first action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 21 June , 2009 Share Posted 21 June , 2009 ... a Red Army soldier in the nearby communal cemetery. How did the latter get there? Something I have often wondered, Nigel. Thanks for reminding us of this Grumpy. The description of the events of Red Dragon Crater in "The war the infantry knew" was among those that started my personal journey into WW1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iain mchenry Posted 21 June , 2009 Share Posted 21 June , 2009 It was also the explosion of the Red Dragon mine that led to the collapse of the tunnel system that Spr William Hackett and his shift were working in. Spr Hackett a tunneller with 254 Tunnelling Coy and an experienced miner, refused to leave a trapped comrade, Pte Thomas Collins, 14th Welsh who was temporarily attached to 253 T Coy. Both men remain underground today, Spr Hackett becoming the only tunneller to receive the VC. Regards Iain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muerrisch Posted 21 June , 2009 Author Share Posted 21 June , 2009 Name: BANKS, ARTHUR CHAPLIN Initials: A C Nationality: United Kingdom Rank: Second Lieutenant Regiment/Service: Royal Welsh Fusiliers Unit Text: 2nd Bn. Age: 20 Date of Death: 22/06/1916 Additional information: Son of Mr. C. P. and Helen Agnes Banks, of Arnold House, Llanddulas, Denbighshire. Native of Kendal, Westmorland. Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead Grave/Memorial Reference: II. A. 1. Cemetery: GORRE BRITISH AND INDIAN CEMETERY Died from being stabbed in the stomach following a hand to hand fight with a German soldier. It was his first action. Whoops! also missed Captain Owen Price-Edwards and 2Lt T A Crosland. Of Crosland: Second Lieutenant Trevor Allington Crosland was born 28 December 1896 of prosperous parents. His father was a woollen manufacturer, and they lived at Birkley Grange, Birkley, Huddersfield. Young Crosland attended Harrow 1911 to 1914 and Sandhurst [RMC] and was commissioned into RWF 11 August 1915. He was sent to the 2nd Battalion, and joined on 6 June next year. He had three weeks to live. Trevor was appointed to B Company, whose fate it was to be in the line when the largest German mine of the war exploded under them at what was subsequently called Red Dragon Crater. His Commanding Officer, Lieutenant Colonel Crawshay wrote to Crosland senior: ‘….. he was a splendid boy and one of the sort we can ill spare. On night 21/22 at 2AM the enemy blew an enormous mine. I regret to say that the trench, in which your son was, was blown up. I am sad to say our casualties were heavy for the mine. They then attacked us after an intense barrage, but got badly defeated, leaving a certain number of dead in our trenches. It is really too sad, we all miss him, and everyone was very fond of him. I am afraid you will feel it very much. It will be some satisfaction to you to know he was a real soldier and leader of men. You will remember me – you brought your boy to see me when he joined. Knowing you as I do, and having seen you both together, my sympathy goes out more than I can say. I voice the opinion of my regiment. Tibs Crawshay.’ Trevor received three other tributes. Two were from his Divisional General and from the Colonel of the Royal Welch Fusiliers. The third came from an unexpected source. Sergeant Roderick wrote that ‘ ….. it seemed so hard that he should be taken from us so unexpectedly and on his first time in trenches. I am an old soldier, at least for the present time, and quite knew the value of your son. He showed great fortitude to fight, and I am sure he would have made a name for himself had he been spared’. Trevor Allington Crosland’s body was discovered in an isolated unmarked grave or cavity, with another officer who was subsequently identified as Captain Price-Edwards, on 1 July 1925 [date is that provided by CWGC, at odds with TWTIK date of 1926]. Both these officers were re-interred at Cabaret Rouge British Military Cemetery. The bundle of personal effects sent to Crosland senior was listed: · gold wrist watch · 2 pocket photo frames · 1 cigar case · bundle of letters · cloth star His data are on PRO folder WO 339 34839. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_hughes Posted 21 June , 2009 Share Posted 21 June , 2009 Remembering, 11146 L/Cpl. (Pte.) Thomas Crowe Williams, MM, "B" Company 2nd RWF, born and enlisted at Beaumaris, Anglesey. An "Old Contemptible", landed in France 11 August 1914. Killed in action aged 23. Commemorated also on the Beaumaris panel of the North Wales Heroes Memorial Arch, Bangor; and Beaumaris Town War Memorial. Mewn angof ni chant fod, Gwyr y cledd, mawr eu clod They shall not be forgotten, Men of the sword, great their fame LST_164 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geraint Posted 21 June , 2009 Share Posted 21 June , 2009 None of my townfolk died here; though as with Andrew; a handfull were there and survived. My men were recovering from the debacle of 9th May 1915 at Givenchy/Festubert, or awaiting their tribulations in July 1916. Thanks Grumpy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Reed Posted 21 June , 2009 Share Posted 21 June , 2009 When you say The crater can be discerned on Google Earth. I presume you mean in outline, as there have been no crater visible directly at ground level for many a year. The "Soviet" soldier almost certainly died in the uniform of the German army given his date of death, but therein lies another story, and another war, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larney Posted 22 June , 2009 Share Posted 22 June , 2009 Remembering the men of West Wales who died in the explosion- William Robert Hughes of Llanglydwen, William Edwards of Carmarthen and Evan James Evans of Garnant. Rest in Peace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brummie Fusilier Posted 22 June , 2009 Share Posted 22 June , 2009 Remembering My Grandfather 36481 George Richard Knight MM. 2nd and 9th Battalion Royal Welsh Fusiliers Today my Grandfather won his MM at Givenchy in the famous battle mentioned above. I have been there many times and attended the burial of Private Clarke a few years ago at Gorre Military Cemetery. Pete www.oldcontemptibles.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
britman Posted 22 June , 2009 Share Posted 22 June , 2009 A big thank you to all of them who perished in this action. We will remember them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarsA Posted 22 June , 2009 Share Posted 22 June , 2009 Thanks for reminding. It made me take out my copy of "Old soldiers never die" , and as usual it was hard to put down. /Lars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muerrisch Posted 22 June , 2009 Author Share Posted 22 June , 2009 When you say I presume you mean in outline, as there have been no crater visible directly at ground level for many a year. The "Soviet" soldier almost certainly died in the uniform of the German army given his date of death, but therein lies another story, and another war, of course. Yes, shadowy outline .... but do you know when it was filled in? please. I had an acquaintance in the 1980s who said he had visited the 'ole, but I was never sure if he was correct. When you say I presume you mean in outline, as there have been no crater visible directly at ground level for many a year. The "Soviet" soldier almost certainly died in the uniform of the German army given his date of death, but therein lies another story, and another war, of course. Yes, shadowy outline .... but do you know when it was filled in? please. I had an acquaintance in the 1980s who said he had visited the 'ole, but I was never sure if he was correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Reed Posted 23 June , 2009 Share Posted 23 June , 2009 I believe it disappeared in the early 1980s. I once spoke to a French farmer who farms the field, but he did not own the land at that time and was not aware of any craters at all, or so he said... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muerrisch Posted 23 June , 2009 Author Share Posted 23 June , 2009 Thanks Paul, Wish I had seen the job being done .... a huge task with 1980s machinery. It is, of course, a war grave, although not formally accepted as such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wulsten Posted 23 June , 2009 Share Posted 23 June , 2009 Just been directed to this topic, remembering James Evans Corporal Royal Welsh Fusiliers 2nd Bn. Age: 34 22/06/1916 7065 Additional information: Son of John and Bridget Evans, of Lower Green, Newcastle-under-Lyme; husband of Emma Evans, of 7, Bristol St., Wolstanton, Stoke-on-Trent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brummie Fusilier Posted 23 June , 2009 Share Posted 23 June , 2009 Didn't the RE do some provisional work filling the Crater in the 20's or 30's. I don't know where I got this thought from but I am sure I have heard something along this line? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Reed Posted 23 June , 2009 Share Posted 23 June , 2009 The crater was certainly there in the 1970s as I have seen photos of the craters in this area, taken at that time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick D Posted 23 June , 2009 Share Posted 23 June , 2009 Can anyone supply a map or diagram to show the location of this crater ? Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J Banning Posted 23 June , 2009 Share Posted 23 June , 2009 Here you go Mick. RE map and modern map for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Reed Posted 23 June , 2009 Share Posted 23 June , 2009 Good maps, Jeremy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick D Posted 23 June , 2009 Share Posted 23 June , 2009 Cheers Jeremy. Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now