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Police officers who fought in the Great War


J Banning
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Tom

Thanks for posting the Lanarkshire police war memorial.

CaryIW

Thanks for trying to post the Liverpool memorial, unfortunately I am unable to see the memorial and names as there is only a dark screen when it opens.

John

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Tom

Thanks for posting the Lanarkshire police war memorial.

CaryIW

Thanks for trying to post the Liverpool memorial, unfortunately I am unable to see the memorial and names as there is only a dark screen when it opens.

John

John

That is strange. I checked the links just now and they worked for me but I wonder if it's anything to do with me posting them using an Android device, or something your end.

Can someone else check the links and let us know please. If it's something my end I'll go on to a laptop and re-post them

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CaryIW

I have just tried them again and still cannot view them, I am also on Chrome, must be some Gremlins in my computer.

John

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I'm afraid I have not read through the entire thread but a relative served in the M.P. from 1917 until he was wounded by shrapnel in 1918. He was Reginald John Foxley, from Marlebone London. #6138 M.M.P. He was born 1895 and died in 1977. His service and pension records are on Ancestry. His father John was a police sergeant. Anyway, if it is of no interest just ignore the post.

Hazel

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Hazel

The thread was about police officers who served in the war, but thanks for your contribution in relation to Reginald and I will certainly have a look at his record on Ancestry.

John

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  • 2 months later...

I have just joined the Forum and are looking for any help in researching those police officers from what is now Durham Constabulary that fought in the war. I have the names of those that died, unfortunately i dont have any records of those that fought and returned. Any help would be gratefully received.

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tash1970

Just to let you know that I have already researched the men on the Durham County Constabulary war memorial and have incorporated the information in a book I am publishing in the next month or so, 'Blue Line to Trench Line'. I have also researched all of the men who served and returned and have that information in another book. You can get in touch if you wish, send me a pm.

John

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I have been researching Police Officers who served with the Scots Guards, and have managed to collate casualty figures from many County, Burgh and City forces in Scotland and beyond.

A large percentage of Policemen appear to have joined the Guards Regiments. There may be a simple answer to why this was. Many Ex-Guardsmen joined the Police on completion of their military service and many of them would still have been in the reserve. Also, Police Forces of the day would have had similar height restrictions in place to those of the Guards, and therefore Ex-Guardsmen would have been seen as ideal candidates to become Policemen Tthis was still true until fairly recently, when height restrictions were removed, and graduates are now the preferred candidates. As I understand it, early in the war they were required to return to the Colours, and Chief Constables would have been unable to prevent this, although later in the war, this appears to have changed.

City of Glasgow Police WW1 Roll of Honour lists 173 officers. 83 of those served with Guards Regiments, and all but 10 of those were Scots Guardsmen.

One action sticks out amongst many as being particularly costly in terms of Policemen KIA. The 1st Bn Scots Guards were on the front line at Cuinchy on 25 January 1915, with 1st Bn Coldstream Guards on their right flank. This was the salient adjacent to La Bassee canal and was known as The Battle of the Brick Stacks.

It was a costly day for 1SG with 11 officers and 262 other ranks killed or missing. I have been able to establish that 34 of those listed as KIA were Policemen, with a staggering 28 of those from the City of Glasgow force alone.

The others were Lanarkshire (2), Ayrshire (2), Paisley Burgh (1) and Motherwell (1).

I have not been able to find information from many of the smaller Burgh/County forces or Edinburgh City Police.

I have not researched the Coldstream Guards losses on that day, but they also had substantial casualties, and it's possible that a number of those could also have been Policemen.

From the research that I have done, it seems that 25 January 1915 was the costliest day in terms of Scottish Police casualties.

If anyone has further information it would be most welcome.

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No Scots Guards casualties from Arbroath anyway.

Arbroaths Chief Constable James MacDonald was given permission by the town council to enlist in late November 1915.

Aside from MacDonald, 9 of the 11 Policemen of enlistment age also asked permission, all being married, 4 were allowed.

In total seven of the towns Police force served, 3 of them died on service late in the war.

Stewart Wilkie Paterson, Gnr. R.M. Artillery KIA 10/07/18

Alexander Sturrock, L.Cpl. Military Police Flu 27/10/1918

William Nicol Lindsay, L.Cpl. Military Police KIA 06/11/18

Also related to the town and Policemen elsewhere who perished during the war:

W. Doig, Carnoustie (Army Reservist)

D S Hogg, Constable in Carnoustie

A Kidd, Canadian Police, formerly of Arbroath Police

T Maguire, Perth

J Morrison, Glasgow

J Robertson, Glasgow

T Robertson, London

A Simpson, South African Police

J Todd, Leith

[edit] i should have said that the only Scots Guardsman in the whole list is Morrison, who is on the Glasgow Memorial, so you'll have his details.

Derek.

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TwoEssGee

Scots Guards casualties from north east of England forces.

Pte 6657 David Bain McLennan KIA 14.9.1914 (Northumberland County Constabulary)

Pte 5342 Adam Hogg KIA 6.10.1914 (North East Railway Police)

Pte 7870 George Brown KIA 11.11.1914 (Durham County Constabulary)

Pte 7794 Frederick Wright Nunn KIA 11.11.1914 (Middlesbrough Borough Police)

Pte 5460 John Edward Hartland KIA 14.8.1916 (Hartlepool Borough Police)

Pte 14077 John Goodall KIA 31.7.1917 (Berwick on Tweed Borough Police)

There were also 22 Coldstream Guards, 9 Grenadier Guards, and 3 Irish Guards KIA.

Those that served and returned, 61 Coldstream Guards, 9 Scots Guards, 19 Grenadier Guards, 7 Irish Guards, 1 Welsh Guard, 4 Life Guards.

John

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Derek,

Thanks for the information. The SWMP has been of great assistance to me when collating the information.

John

Thanks also for you help. I did not have John Hartland or John Goodall on my list.

I should have mentioned above that in addition to the 73 Glasgow Police Scots Guards casualties, I have identified an additional 58 Scots Guardsmen who served with other Police forces. I am certain that there will be many more that I have not yet found. I have only identified one serving and one former Constable who were with the London Metropolitan. I can't believe there are not others.

If anyone has any more information, particulary for the Met, I'd be very greatful.

Iain.

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  • 4 months later...

Nice photos, John. I have a similar one of the Preston Borough Force in 1922. Plenty of gallantry medals on show.

Ken

Am currently trying to ID them! Do you know any of their identities Ken? I've also got the 1929 similar photo from the Harris Museum. Community up and running on the new IWM site https://livesofthefirstworldwar.org/community/192 if there's anything you can add?

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Hi,

Fife and Kirkaldy Police Officers serving with the Scots Guards at the Guards Depot Pirbright - No names I am afraid, if anyone can add names I would be grateful.

regards

John

post-27843-0-31777700-1401482981_thumb.j

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  • 3 weeks later...

I have been researching Police Officers who served with the Scots Guards, and have managed to collate casualty figures from many County, Burgh and City forces in Scotland and beyond.

A large percentage of Policemen appear to have joined the Guards Regiments. There may be a simple answer to why this was. Many Ex-Guardsmen joined the Police on completion of their military service and many of them would still have been in the reserve. Also, Police Forces of the day would have had similar height restrictions in place to those of the Guards, and therefore Ex-Guardsmen would have been seen as ideal candidates to become Policemen Tthis was still true until fairly recently, when height restrictions were removed, and graduates are now the preferred candidates. As I understand it, early in the war they were required to return to the Colours, and Chief Constables would have been unable to prevent this, although later in the war, this appears to have changed.

City of Glasgow Police WW1 Roll of Honour lists 173 officers. 83 of those served with Guards Regiments, and all but 10 of those were Scots Guardsmen.

One action sticks out amongst many as being particularly costly in terms of Policemen KIA. The 1st Bn Scots Guards were on the front line at Cuinchy on 25 January 1915, with 1st Bn Coldstream Guards on their right flank. This was the salient adjacent to La Bassee canal and was known as The Battle of the Brick Stacks.

It was a costly day for 1SG with 11 officers and 262 other ranks killed or missing. I have been able to establish that 34 of those listed as KIA were Policemen, with a staggering 28 of those from the City of Glasgow force alone.

The others were Lanarkshire (2), Ayrshire (2), Paisley Burgh (1) and Motherwell (1).

I have not been able to find information from many of the smaller Burgh/County forces or Edinburgh City Police.

I have not researched the Coldstream Guards losses on that day, but they also had substantial casualties, and it's possible that a number of those could also have been Policemen.

From the research that I have done, it seems that 25 January 1915 was the costliest day in terms of Scottish Police casualties.

If anyone has further information it would be most welcome.

Hello there. No casualties from the Preston Borough Police, but the following PCs went to war with the Scots Guards:

PC 30 Wilfred McCann - service number 7705

PC 44 Walter William Burke - service number 10844

PC 12 James Ashworth - service number 11874

PC 77 Vaughan Walley - service number 5963

PC 85 Thomas Almond - service number 7614

PC 103 Henry Cragg - service number 11982

PC 47 Thomas Henry Duckett - service number 10768 (was a POW)

PC Herbert Hill - service number 5303 (was a POW)

The majority of Preston Borough officers were either RFA (usually pre-war reservists) or RGA, with a good number of MFP too.

tash1970

Just to let you know that I have already researched the men on the Durham County Constabulary war memorial and have incorporated the information in a book I am publishing in the next month or so, 'Blue Line to Trench Line'. I have also researched all of the men who served and returned and have that information in another book. You can get in touch if you wish, send me a pm.

John

Did you get to publish this John? I'm in the process of researching all the Preston Borough men who fought and it has crossed my mind that there's enough information for a book but questioned the wider appeal.

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May be of interest. I don't know on which force he served, but below is Police Constable Frederick Charles Raines, lost in the sinking of HMS Hawke. CWGC shows:

Stoker First Class, Service no. 296016, Died 15/10/1914, age 31, remembered on the Chatham Naval Memorial, panel 5. Son of William and Elizabeth Raines of Chartham, Canterbury; husband of Emma Elizabeth Raines of 47 Park Road, Faversham.

Chris

post-1571-0-90799100-1403624763_thumb.jp

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Guest Uricanejack

I have been researching Police Officers who served with the Scots Guards, and have managed to collate casualty figures from many County, Burgh and City forces in Scotland and beyond.

A large percentage of Policemen appear to have joined the Guards Regiments. There may be a simple answer to why this was. Many Ex-Guardsmen joined the Police on completion of their military service and many of them would still have been in the reserve. Also, Police Forces of the day would have had similar height restrictions in place to those of the Guards, and therefore Ex-Guardsmen would have been seen as ideal candidates to become Policemen Tthis was still true until fairly recently, when height restrictions were removed, and graduates are now the preferred candidates. As I understand it, early in the war they were required to return to the Colours, and Chief Constables would have been unable to prevent this, although later in the war, this appears to have changed.

City of Glasgow Police WW1 Roll of Honour lists 173 officers. 83 of those served with Guards Regiments, and all but 10 of those were Scots Guardsmen.

One action sticks out amongst many as being particularly costly in terms of Policemen KIA. The 1st Bn Scots Guards were on the front line at Cuinchy on 25 January 1915, with 1st Bn Coldstream Guards on their right flank. This was the salient adjacent to La Bassee canal and was known as The Battle of the Brick Stacks.

It was a costly day for 1SG with 11 officers and 262 other ranks killed or missing. I have been able to establish that 34 of those listed as KIA were Policemen, with a staggering 28 of those from the City of Glasgow force alone.

The others were Lanarkshire (2), Ayrshire (2), Paisley Burgh (1) and Motherwell (1).

I have not been able to find information from many of the smaller Burgh/County forces or Edinburgh City Police.

I have not researched the Coldstream Guards losses on that day, but they also had substantial casualties, and it's possible that a number of those could also have been Policemen.

From the research that I have done, it seems that 25 January 1915 was the costliest day in terms of Scottish Police casualties.

If anyone has further information it would be most welcome.

I don't know any figures for Glasgow Police Officers serving in WW1.

I do know my Grandfather joined the Glasgow Police in 1909 after working for the railway.

I'm not sure exactly when he joined up.

But I do know he served with the 8th battalion of the Royal Highlanders the official name of the Black Watch which was quite confusing trying to find a record of his service.

He also served with the Royal Engineers.

He was taken Prisoner in April 1918 his brother also serving with the 8th battalion was killed.

He was listed as dead, He was thrown off a POW train along with the dead. Fortunately He was found alive by a Belgian Doctor out walking by the tracks. Rescued and hidden until able to returned to the regiment after the armistice.

We have a letter from the Glasgow Police POW fund congratulating him on his return from the dead.

From what my father says there were quite a few other Police men from Glasgow who were on the western front.

He used to tell a story about becoming detached from his unit in no mans land.

Making his way back to the lines he wandered into an area of the line held by the HLI. The moment of recognition was according to him, his most frightening moment of the war. The whole company was made up of characters from his beat “Gorbals Cross”. His first thought they would shoot him on sight. Instead they greeted him as a long lost friend and he spent the night as an honoured guest before he made his way back to his own unit.

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No Scots Guards casualties from Arbroath anyway.

Arbroaths Chief Constable James MacDonald was given permission by the town council to enlist in late November 1915.

Aside from MacDonald, 9 of the 11 Policemen of enlistment age also asked permission, all being married, 4 were allowed.

In total seven of the towns Police force served, 3 of them died on service late in the war.

Stewart Wilkie Paterson, Gnr. R.M. Artillery KIA 10/07/18

Alexander Sturrock, L.Cpl. Military Police Flu 27/10/1918

William Nicol Lindsay, L.Cpl. Military Police KIA 06/11/18

Also related to the town and Policemen elsewhere who perished during the war:

W. Doig, Carnoustie (Army Reservist)

D S Hogg, Constable in Carnoustie

A Kidd, Canadian Police, formerly of Arbroath Police

T Maguire, Perth

J Morrison, Glasgow

J Robertson, Glasgow

T Robertson, London

A Simpson, South African Police

J Todd, Leith

[edit] i should have said that the only Scots Guardsman in the whole list is Morrison, who is on the Glasgow Memorial, so you'll have his details.

Derek.

Hi Derek,

Do you have the Rennie brothers from Dundee? One was married to my G Grandfather's sister.

Rgds

Tim D

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