ph0ebus Posted 19 May , 2009 Author Share Posted 19 May , 2009 Hi all, Received Albert's death notice in the mail. Well, most of it, anyway...about a third of the envelope and its contents were sheared off somewhere between Sheffield and the US. Luckily, Albert's notice was intact, and read as follows: Bell - On March 18th, 1941, at 105 Tadcaster Road, Albert Edward, the devoted husband of Lillian Bell, late of Shiregreen. Interment, Crookes Cemetery, Saturday, March 22nd, 1941 at 2:45 p.m. Friends please accept this, the only intimation. Maybe of additional interest (or not?) was an 'In Memoriam' on the same page: Bell - In loving memory of a dear brother, John, who died March 19, 1940. The joys he missed on life's highway May he find in the Kingdom of Heaven. - From sister Annie Lizzie, brother-in-law William. There may have been other in memoriam's to John Bell on the same page but they were torn off. -Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil@basildon Posted 19 May , 2009 Share Posted 19 May , 2009 I have located Frederick Blacktin's army record, it lists all his surviving relatives (mother, 3 sisters and a brother). I have not been able to locate him on the census returns but I will try with his siblings. The army records on Ancestry are a bit confused, they include another soldiers records interspersed with Fredericks but there is quite a bit of useful information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kath Posted 19 May , 2009 Share Posted 19 May , 2009 Good news, Phil. Kath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ph0ebus Posted 19 May , 2009 Author Share Posted 19 May , 2009 Phil, Great work. I am going to try and focus on Albert and the ship, but the following up on lines of inquiry about other members if the family is just as important. Let us know what you discover. I forgot to mention that Chris Hobbs also found another Bell grave near AEB's grave: -Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil@basildon Posted 19 May , 2009 Share Posted 19 May , 2009 The siblings of Frederick Blacktin. Emma, age 37 married name Smith, address 9 Westbury Street, Glasgow. Alice, age 35 married name Elphinston(e)? address 61 Nether Green Road, Sheffield. John William, age 30, 61 Nether Green Road, Sheffield. Elizabeth age 25 married name Elphiston(e)? 'Isle of Wight View' Tan***th Road, Bittern, Southampton. Apart from some of the details being hard to read I believe that an error has been made in the married names of either Alice or Elizabeth. The document though it does give ages of the siblings, it is dated Aug 1919, and the ages quoted could be as at 1914 when he signed up, 1916 when he was killed or 1919, it is simply unclear on this point. It is clear however that this is not Lilian Bell's immediate family so I am going to concentrate on the descendants of the Bell family. EDIT. The headstone near to 'our' Bells probably has little if anything to do with them. Bell appears to be a common surname in Sheffield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Dale Posted 19 May , 2009 Share Posted 19 May , 2009 There is a living relative on Genes Reunited who has been to have a look at the ongoing discussion.... Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil@basildon Posted 19 May , 2009 Share Posted 19 May , 2009 As I thought the only one sister of Frederick Blacktin married an Elphinstone, this was Alice in Oct-Dec 1914 this was to James K Elphinstone. Emma (Smith) married in Jul-Aug 1905. There is no record of Elizabeth being married. I have found James Kenneth Elphinstones military record, he married Alice on the 8th Nov 1914. A daughter (Freda Elizabeth) was born on 23rd Aug 1915. I am still looking at the rest of the papers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil@basildon Posted 19 May , 2009 Share Posted 19 May , 2009 There is a living relative on Genes Reunited who has been to have a look at the ongoing discussion.... Robert Is he/she going to get in touch with us or can we contact them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Dale Posted 19 May , 2009 Share Posted 19 May , 2009 Not sure - I'll ask. Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil@basildon Posted 20 May , 2009 Share Posted 20 May , 2009 I have tried looking for Reginald Bell's move to South Africa. I have not found any record yet but I have tried up to 1940, he may have emigrated post WW2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 20 May , 2009 Share Posted 20 May , 2009 I have tried looking for Reginald Bell's move to South Africa. I have not found any record yet but I have tried up to 1940, he may have emigrated post WW2. Hi Phil, I am Judith, I am the great, great, grand daughter of Albert Edward Bell. The Reginald Bell, that you are talking about, I met when I was a Child, My grandfather, who is Derek Vincent Bell, was his nephew and is still alive. I will ask my granddad, he may remember when he moved to South Africa, so I will find out and get back to you. From Judith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil@basildon Posted 20 May , 2009 Share Posted 20 May , 2009 Judith, thank you for getting in touch. I hope this thread is informative for you in seeking your family history, but it is an enormous amount of pages to get through, if you want any help please do not hesitate to ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil@basildon Posted 20 May , 2009 Share Posted 20 May , 2009 Judith, the details of your grandfathers migration to Australia can be seen on post #177 on this thread. The link to the actual document is on post #195. You can see were your grandfather lived on Google Earth, the address was 5, Lonsdale Road, Walkley, Sheffield. When you go into Google Earth increase the magnification until the little cameras are visible, one of these will show as #4 Lonsdale Road, click on the camera and the picture comes up facing away from #5 (you should see a white van) turn 180 degrees to the left and you should see the house, the number is easily readable and it is painted light blue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Dale Posted 21 May , 2009 Share Posted 21 May , 2009 Pleased to say that another living relative has been to have a look at the forum - and may feel moved to contribute! Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 21 May , 2009 Share Posted 21 May , 2009 Judith, the details of your grandfathers migration to Australia can be seen on post #177 on this thread. The link to the actual document is on post #195. You can see were your grandfather lived on Google Earth, the address was 5, Lonsdale Road, Walkley, Sheffield. When you go into Google Earth increase the magnification until the little cameras are visible, one of these will show as #4 Lonsdale Road, click on the camera and the picture comes up facing away from #5 (you should see a white van) turn 180 degrees to the left and you should see the house, the number is easily readable and it is painted light blue. Thanks for your help, very interesting, I told my mother about this site, she is looking forward to having a look herself, because this is her great grandfather. I can tell you that Albert Edward Bell's DOB is 5th April 1871, I am not sure if any one else located that yet. We were interested in finding out that John Bell enlisted in Australia, we always thought he enlisted in England, we knew he died in Belgium though. So thanks again to all who provided information. Judith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ph0ebus Posted 21 May , 2009 Author Share Posted 21 May , 2009 Thanks for your help, very interesting, I told my mother about this site, she is looking forward to having a look herself, because this is her great grandfather. I can tell you that Albert Edward Bell's DOB is 5th April 1871, I am not sure if any one else located that yet. We were interested in finding out that John Bell enlisted in Australia, we always thought he enlisted in England, we knew he died in Belgium though. So thanks again to all who provided information. Judith Hi Judith, I am so pleased we were able to establish contact with you and your family. I apologize for not posting sooner but shortly after my last post the other day my computer suffered a catastrophic failure and have been offline since then. At present I am posting this from the local library in East Harlem, NYC. I do have Albert's DOB and will be happy to provide a full summary of what we have been able to establish once I get my computer back from the shop. What would be absolutely wonderful to see, if you have it, would be a photo of Albert. We found one photo of his son and namesake but that is all we have at present, I'm afraid, in terms of photographs. I had checked with the fellow who sold me Albert's postcard and he had told me he had bought it as a part of a larger collection, and had no more materials from Albert, so it was likely in a few other folks hands before I found it. I will also try and connect you with them if you like in case he encounters any more materials relating to your family. Again, wonderful to hear from you, welcome to the forum and I hope we can continue the discussion. Take care, -Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ph0ebus Posted 21 May , 2009 Author Share Posted 21 May , 2009 Hi all, As an aside, given my present lack of internet access it goes without saying that I have made no more inroads since my last post, but I do expect Duncan Haws book on my doorstep any day now. We'll see if that adds to the picture. I will be only intermittently able (from the public library) to access the forum and reply for the foreseeable future, so I apologize in advance for that. One other update: no new hits on the posts I made on the various Sheffield Forums, though another kind soul has offered to venture back to Crookes to have another look around with their camera in tow. We'll see if that gives us some more to work with. I will also scan and post AEB's death notice from the Sheffield Star once I have the technological capacity to do so. It is truly amazing to see where this story has gone, and I am quite excited to see where it goes from here. All the best, Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil@basildon Posted 22 May , 2009 Share Posted 22 May , 2009 Daniel, sorry to hear of your computer problems, let me know if you require anything looking up. I am going on a day trip on the 6th June and will be passing through Belgium on my way to Holland, but it will be unlikely that I will be able to stop for long enough to search for any gravestones ect. but I hope to be able to visit Ypres later in the year. If I am able I will try to visit John Bells grave if it is not to far away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Dale Posted 22 May , 2009 Share Posted 22 May , 2009 The other living descendant of AEB has some post WW1 photos of him (rather grainy I fear) and of Lilian Blacktin, but he's having some trouble registering on the Forum at present. As a relative newcomer myself, I'm not sure what to advise him to do for the best. Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil@basildon Posted 22 May , 2009 Share Posted 22 May , 2009 I have looked up John Bell's grave details. He is buried at La Clytte military cemetery, section IV, row A, plot 16. The cemetery is 8km (5 miles) west of Ypres, I may be able to pay a visit but as I will be with a coach party it might not be possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil@basildon Posted 24 May , 2009 Share Posted 24 May , 2009 Judith, How are you getting on with this thread? Is there anything new that you have found out from this thread? Daniel, When you are back on line I think you should ask for this thread to be moved to 'Classic Threads'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 24 May , 2009 Share Posted 24 May , 2009 Hi all at last I am on, My Name is Peter and my wife Marie ( Nee Bell) is the Great Grandaughter of A E Bell and the Aunt of Judith. We have been doing the Bell family history for a while and can answer some of you Questions. A E bell Snr worked for a steel mill in Sheffield as a traveller, he was very well off and had servants and a fine house. he spoke 8 languages and travelled extensivly to the US and India. He had 10 sons and one daughter who died at the age of 4 on 4/9/1911 ,he retyurned to Sheffield in 1916 for the birth of his last child on 12/8/1916. George & John Bell came to Australia in 1913 and both enlisted in AIF the rest you already know. Reg Bell was in the RAF in both wars WW1 as a fightere pilot and WW2 as a bomber and transport pilot, shot down near the end of the war and saw the end from hospital. Moved to South Africa in 1960 AE Bell jnr worked for Firth Stainless Steel in Sheffield as fitter and turner then as a manager and was pretty well off, came to Australia at invitation of George who sponsored him in 1928 Aboard the SS Bendigo, it broke a prop shaft on the way and they transfered to ss Balranald. Depression hit when they landed and could not find work. Served in both Wars Medicaly Discharged for hearing loss. All his 5 children are still with us We do not know anything about his spy work but would love to find out and are willing to help where we can. will post pictures when we work out how. Petr & Marie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil@basildon Posted 24 May , 2009 Share Posted 24 May , 2009 Peter, Great to hear from you. We found out that Albert Bell Senior was a Shell Inspector during the GW. Daniel started it off with the mysterious message he found on a postcard, I take it you have seen both sides of the postcard on the earlier threads. Have you obtained any new information from our investigations? I hope so. Daniel (ph0ebus) has computer problems at the moment so will probably not be available for a few days I feel sure he will have a few questions for you. I will be travelling through Belgium in a couple of weeks time but I doubt if I will be able to stop off anywhere but I will be going to Ypres on the 11th November and I will try to visit John R's grave and leave a poppy or similar on behalf of yourselves and those who have contributed to this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kath Posted 24 May , 2009 Share Posted 24 May , 2009 Quote Phil: "I have just found the 1901 census returns. He is still living in Nether Hallam but with wife Lilian and five children and a housemaid. The address is 321 Springvale road and his occupation is as a Commercial Traveller." 321 is house with ivy over front garden wall. http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&sour...,190.02,,0,8.59 Kath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 25 May , 2009 Share Posted 25 May , 2009 Here is a couple of pics of A E Bell Snr Sorry they are not better quality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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