Howe Btn RND - Enlistment in 1914 of a regular?

[brimacombe]

Hope someone might be able to shed some light on this for me - one of my 'Holsworthy Boys'....

Frederick Skinner (DEV 230051) enlisted into the Royal Navy on 9th March 1904 - commencing his Twelve Year Engagement on his 18th Birthday on 8th october 1904. He appears to have spent the majority of his pre-war service in Cruisers, and his list of vessels is listed below, transcribed from his Service Sheet.

HMS Northampton March 1904

HMS Cleopatra 15 July 1904 11 Oct 1904

HMS FireQueen 12 Oct 1904 21 Feb 1905

HMS Assistance 22 Feb 1905 9 Dec 1905

HMS Drake 10 Dec 1905 6 May 1907

HMS Vivid I 7 May 1907 2 Sept 1907

HMS Cumberland 3 Sept 1907 6 Sept 1909

HMS Vivid I 7 Sept 1909 21 Sept 1909

HMS Theseus 22 Sept 1909 7 Aug 1911

HMS Cresecent 8 Aug 1911 15 Sept 1911

HMS Flora 16 Sept 1911 30 Mar 1913

HMS Snipe 1 Apr 1913 5 Aug 1913

HMS Flora 6 Aug 1913 19 Dec 1913

HMS Vivid I 20 Dec 1913 18 Sept 1914

HMS Victory IV (RND Howe) 19 Sept 1914

He appears to have spent most of his pre war service serving in Cruisers, interestingly, he was serving aboard HMS Assistance in Oct 1905 when she ran aground at Tetuan Bay, Morocco.

On 19 September 1914 He was posted to Howe Btn, RND.

Now, here come the questions....

Why was Frederick a Pre war sailor with time left to serve on his twelve years, posted to the RND when the Division was formed from the excess formed from the RFR, RNR and RNVR plus excess stokers? Had he been transferred from Flora and placed in the RFR, hence the twelve month period at Vivid I?

Although there is a clear indication of Fredericks rating (O/S to A/B and finally Ldg S/M) I can find no indication of his trade - the only thing that might be a clue is the abreviation 'TM' under sub rating on his RN Record Sheet.

On being posted to the Battalion, where would he have been sent - Crystal Palace? His RND Card states 15.9.1914 Howe Battalion A/22 - does the A/22 mean anything?

Would Frederick have been involved in the Antwerp expedition? His RND Service Card does say that he was 'on the 1914 Star List'?

Frederick was KIA at the Third Battle of Krithia on 4 June 1915.

I really hope someone will be able to help me clear up these questions and I look forward to reading your replies.

Kindest regards

Shawn

[per ardua per mare per terram]

Pictures can be found on this site, I've started you off with HMS Crescent http://www.battleships-cruisers.co.uk/edga...#HMS%20Crescent

There is usually an note to say a man has entered the RFR. Trade rarely appear on the service registers, just sub ratings.

I haven't got Fevyer & Wilson' 1914 Star roll to hand to post what they record. His Star can be verified on the following rolls, both at the UK National Archives - neither are online:

ADM 171/139 Index to issue of 1914 Star 1919-1920 (microfilm)

ADM 171/195 1914 Star: Issue Book 1914 Jan 01 - 1918 Dec 31 (original document)

[brimacombe]

Thanks for that - really looking for more information regarding his RND service though. I have been pretty lucky in being able to piece together his early years and also have a prettu detailed account of how he died - its just his joining the RND in September 1914 up until he left for Galipoli that I'm having trouble with.

Pictures can be found on this site, I've started you off with HMS Crescent http://www.battleships-cruisers.co.uk/edga...#HMS%20Crescent

There is usually an note to say a man has entered the RFR. Trade rarely appear on the service registers, just sub ratings.

I haven't got Fevyer & Wilson' 1914 Star roll to hand to post what they record. His Star can be verified on the following rolls, both at the UK National Archives - neither are online:

ADM 171/139 Index to issue of 1914 Star 1919-1920 (microfilm)

ADM 171/195 1914 Star: Issue Book 1914 Jan 01 - 1918 Dec 31 (original document)

[per ardua per mare per terram]

he was 'on the 1914 Star List' If you confirm his 1914 Star, the roll will probably indicate whether he was at Antwerp. His card sugests that he remained with Howe Battalion for his service, so following their movements will reveal more of what he was doing.

[horatio2]

Many serving RN men, from AB to CPO, were drafted to the RND on formation to provide experienced manpower. He was not RFR. He would have joined Howe Bn. at Betteshanger in Kent where the 2nd Naval Brigade was in training. As a trained man, he would not have gone to Crystal Palace. The A/22 (Ship's Book Number) annotation means he was in 'A' Company of Howe Bn. He was at Antwerp with Howe Bn. and earned the 1914 Star, as indicated on his RND Record Card.

[per ardua per mare per terram]

As most of his service was in older cruisers, by going into the RND he managed to miss out on the various disasters that befell them during the war or the arduous, tedious patrolling with 10th Cruiser Sqn etc.

[per ardua per mare per terram]

Entry from WH Fevyer and JW Wilson, 1914 Star to the Royal Navy and Royal Marines.

Howe Bn F Skinner rank AB 230051 [sent to] father Mr W Skinner 29 Apr 1921. [No clasp recoded on their roll. For some reason the Admiralty does not appear to have automatically awarded the clasp to the dead.]

[brimacombe]

Thanks so much for the detail

You're an officer and a gentleman (there aren't many of us left!)

Kindest regards

Shawn

Entry from WH Fevyer and JW Wilson, 1914 Star to the Royal Navy and Royal Marines.

Howe Bn F Skinner rank AB 230051 [sent to] father Mr W Skinner 29 Apr 1921. [No clasp recoded on their roll. For some reason the Admiralty does not appear to have automatically awarded the clasp to the dead.]

[per ardua per mare per terram]

I'll try to remember to look at the issue book next time I'm at Kew.