Blot on the Landscape

[stripeyman]

its funny they always want to put wind turbines in country areas its about time those in London and Paris had a few , a nice big one on the Eifle tower and convert Londons big eye thingy into one as well. The dam things (wind turbines) are horrid.

Yes and vitually useless, a big con.......if we could only see it.

Best not go any further with this Grundy.

Bob Grundy

[Jason Robins]

Just to add to the debate, whilst visiting the Le Transloy ridges area at the end of March, I came across a couple of notice boards advising that an application was in consultation for a wind farm in the area between Morval, Le Transloy and Sailly. This will undoubtedly have an impact on the battlefield trenchlines as they finished up in this area of the Somme, close to the junction of the British and French lines.

I suspect (gut feeling) that they are very much a "done deal" given the French Authorities enthusiasm for all things green. Maybe one for forum locals on the ground to investigate in more detail.

It will be a shame but this area is already impacted by the motorway and TGV line.

Jason

[John Gilinsky]

Fascinating to see the diverse opinions about battlefield integrity including respect for the unknown dead and buried missing and the necessity of current and future economic sustainability and man built interactions with the environment. Legally mandated corporate responsibility through both local and national French laws related to such development are I believe already in place but as one prosecutor told me there is the law and then there are the ways and means.

John

Toronto

[britman]

I think we all could debate the merits of whether these wind turbines should or shouldn't be built.

I just hope that when they do start to build, they take the appropriate care should they discover remains, etc.

[J Banning]

Thanks Jeremy. I will be there at the end of May so any news would be useful.

Jim

Hi Jim,

Peter and I had a good chat with Alain the other day over lunch and I brought this matter up. He said that under French law the wind turbines are not classed as a building and so there is no prerequisite for archaeology to be undertaken when these pits are dug. He is just as frustrated as the rest of us but is powerless to do anything with his many other projects, limited staff, budget etc. These wind turbines will stretch all the way down to Feuchy Chapel (we passed an obvious hole there ready for the base to be installed) and it looked as if they would be going up soon. Sorry the news isn’t more encouraging. One can only hope that appropriate care is being undertaken by the construction team.

[Michelle Young]

Spotted the ones near Heninel last week and some near Frevent. No getting away from them it seems!

Michelle

[JimSmithson]

Hi

When I was up above Heninel in the summer the signs I showed at the start of the thread were gone and there was no activity. Where did you see them Michelle? - there are about 5 existing ones further south towards Bapaume. I was hopeful that at least above Wancourt they had perhaps run out of money!

This is the one near Feuchy in August - a big hole? I talked to the man on the site (OK with my French lets say I tried to! ) and he became very cagey when I mentioned the nearby cemeteries and the fighting that went on at this spot. I eventually got out of him that there had been some finds, he claimed mostly munitions but I think other artefacts were found. I did not mention human remains as he was a bit bigger than me and I did not want to become one, lost below a large windmill!

It is disturbing what you say Jeremy - certainly the ones above Wancourt could unearth quite a lot and my experiences in the summer did not give me much hope in the contractors.

Jim

[Michelle Young]

Perhaps those were the ones Jim, having spent a lot of time around Wancourt I can say we didn't see any there, sorry to mislead you.

Michelle

[JimSmithson]

No problem Michelle - I just had a nasty thought that in the 6 weeks I've been away they had managed to sprout!!

Alain's comment about stretching down to the new one in Feuchy does worry me that there may only be a temporary reprieve for Wancourt.

Jim

[Wingerdave]

Hi there,

What I can't understand is that there doesn't seem te be any governmental body that vets these sites and watches over them during the work. At least then there would be someone who could check the "finds". If those guys found some artefacts they certainly found the previous owners !!!.

Maybe we should just sit back and wait for some idiot to drill straight though an unexploded mine, shell etc. Even the French would stop and scratch their heads if that happened.

Dave.

[JimSmithson]

I'm in France again the week after next so I'll have a look and see how things are progressing.

Jim

[JimSmithson]

Here is the present state of affairs of the one near Feuchy Chapel. It seems to have taken a long period of time to get the base in place.

Being a Saturday I did wander around the site (naughty I know) to look at the spoil and the stratification in the earth around the concrete (watched too much Time Team ). Couldn't see anything of interest.

Above Wancourt/Heninel the signs are still absent and no activity so maybe a reprieve for a year or 2.

Jim

[JimSmithson]

They are back! The signs above Wancourt/ Cherisy are back in place which means at least 3 new wind turbines are going up around the vicinity of the Hindenburg Line on the high ground.

Let's see what they 'dig up'!?

Jim

[fritz]

Jim,

perhaps we should understand their doing as chance.

Fritz

[Muerrisch]

In 100 years time people will marvel at the gullibility and ignorance of our politicians regarding wind power.

I was a meteorologist for 41 years, a real one, not a predictor of barbecue summers and mild winters, and I know a thing or two about wind.

Just when you need it, in the middle of a cold winter anticyclone with snow and frost around, the air is flat calm. So one needs, permanently, a full back-up of conventional sources. There is no efficient way of storing surplus electricity produced in gales.

The climatic change lobby is inextricably linked with commerce, with both feathering their own nests, and never mind the environment.

By the way, UK has NO CHANCE WHATSOEVER of meeting its published targets for wind power.

Instead of wind power, the government should, years ago, have encouraged by every means solar power, either for domestic hot water, or to feed the grid. Unlike wind power, it does not pollute visually, it is far more efficient, and even gives modest output during dull days ..... at night, the demand for electricity falls a great deal. In Germany, Luxembourg and Switzerland solar panels are commonplace and multiplying rapidly. France put its money on nuclear energy. And we build windmills.

And you wonder why I am .........G R U M P Y

[squirrel]

Politicians? Wind? Perhaps it is the only solution recognised by them that they are familiar with.

[fritz]

I see some of you have a problem with politicians.

But I mean another chance. To see what the workers dig up. Perhaps we are able to give new graves a name.

Fritz

[Deerhunter]

I see some of you have a problem with politicians.

But I mean another chance. To see what the workers dig up. Perhaps we are able to give new graves a name.

Fritz

Aha, Fritz, I see the Hanoverian horse as your avatar.

I wore one of these on my upper arm as my Regiment's distinctive insignia for a number of years. We originally occupied the Heidekaserne in Celle, then moved to Osnabrueck, before finally returning to the UK in the mid-90's. I now have a 10" porcelain model of the hanoverian horse in my dining room, which was a gift from our Mess when I left (the horse, not the dining room).

[JimSmithson]

Deerhunter

What unit were you in whilst in Osnabrück? It's just that I am Deputy Head in a school that used to take kids from there in the 90's.

Sorry Fritz but I do not have your confidence in the process that will take place. I hope someone does monitor the action; I am going to go to the Marie in Heninel in June and talk (well try to, my French being what it is) about where they are digging and show them what is there using trench map overlays. Got to give it a go!

Jim

[stripeyman]

I agree with Mr Grumpy 100%

Bob

[fritz]

Hi Deerhunter,

nice to see you here, following a good old Georgian tradition. Heidekaserne in Celle has a very great tradition. I remember the big Union Jack on its roof. Today it is the Town Hall of Celle, the old drill halls nearby are used for events etc.

This link may be of interest for you if not known

http://images.google.de/imgres?imgurl=http...l%3Dde%26sa%3DN

Jim,

I think it is the teacher inside of me who ever let me think the best of others. (Is this sentence understandable for an Brit??) A good idea to make the French authorities sensitiv for this matter.

Fritz

[JimSmithson]

Quick update. The signs have gone again!! Watch this space.

Jim

[towisuk]

They managed to put up a few (uneconomic)turbines straddling the German trenches to the north of Mory copse without anyone noticing......ground that the Kings Liverpool attacked over in August 1918..

The only thing that that has achieved, is that we are able to get right into the fields by car where the attack took place, using the tarmac roads constructed to the base of each wind turbine!

Google view of area covered by the wind turbines.....

regards

Tom

[towisuk]

From Linesman....

[towisuk]

Here's a couple of the wind turbines that they've put up, Mory Copse on the right of the photo, excuse the drops of water on the camera lens, it was a rainy day.....

Tom