Identify regiment

[Tom Buchan]

Firstly 1,000 apologies from an inexperienced user. My query relates to my great uncle William Walker. I know precious little about him other than this foto which was taken in 1941 and from my research appears to show his collar badge as the Australian Commonwealth forces. My understanding is that he was born and raised in Scotland?

Any idea which regiment and what is that on his wrist?

[Greg]

It is definitely AIF-the AIF did not use regimental badges as such but had a single badge- the 'Rising Sun'( apparently based on a trophy of bayonets) and identified battalions and other units by coloured patches. It was a very logical system so the shape told you division, colours arm of service, etc.. Unfortunately it is difficult to work out colours from black and white pictures - the type of negative/process used affects the relative shades. This link shows the system of patches. http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-badges...0-all_units.htm.

All AIF service records are online at the Australian War Memorial website for free so you should be able to look at his service record and work out which unit he was in.

Probably a wristwatch- possibly made out of an old pocket watch?

Good luckl

Greg

[Muerrisch]

wounded on two occasions and three years service outside Australia.

[Michelle Young]

If it was taken in 1941 then I'm afraid that you are asking on the wrong forum; this forum is WW1. Looking at the blouses the ladies are wearing, I'd say earlier. He has 2 wound stripes on his wrist. Not sure which Btn he is in, looking at the patch, very difficult- maybe 9th. http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-badges...hes/inf-ww1.htm

Plentyoif men from the British Isles ended up in Australia, emigrating for work before the war.

Cheers, Michelle

[Tom Buchan]

It is definitely AIF-the AIF did not use regimental badges as such but had a single badge- the 'Rising Sun'( apparently based on a trophy of bayonets) and identified battalions and other units by coloured patches. It was a very logical system so the shape told you division, colours arm of service, etc.. Unfortunately it is difficult to work out colours from black and white pictures - the type of negative/process used affects the relative shades. This link shows the system of patches. http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-badges...0-all_units.htm.

All AIF service records are online at the Australian War Memorial website for free so you should be able to look at his service record and work out which unit he was in.

Probably a wristwatch- possibly made out of an old pocket watch?

Good luckl

Greg

Many thanks Greg I will look st the suggested sites

wounded on two occasions and three years service outside Australia.

Many thanks Grumpy

It appears I have a new link to the family history

[Tom Buchan]

If it was taken in 1941 then I'm afraid that you are asking on the wrong forum; this forum is WW1. Looking at the blouses the ladies are wearing, I'd say earlier. He has 2 wound stripes on his wrist. Not sure which Btn he is in, looking at the patch, very difficult- maybe 9th. http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-badges...hes/inf-ww1.htm

Plentyoif men from the British Isles ended up in Australia, emigrating for work before the war.

Cheers, Michelle

Many thanks Michelle

I appreciate I am 1 war too late, but I knew that the site users would help. Sorry if I am a nuisance

Regards

TMB

wounded on two occasions and three years service outside Australia.

Many thanks for your assistance

[ian turner]

He would have a service record, probably viewable online: http://naa12.naa.gov.au/Login.htm (select 'guest' to log in) - There are over 200 Walker records, so you will need to do a bit of trawling through to ID your man. It will help if you can uncover any additional info on him - where born, birth date, etc.

I agree that his wristwatch appears to be a converted pocket watch, and possibly with a protective cover, making it a 'trench watch'.

Ian

[Michelle Young]

There is a William Walker in the Great War records from Kilmarnock, NOK David Walker.

[Tom Buchan]

There is a William Walker in the Great War records from Kilmarnock, NOK David Walker.

Many thanks Michelle.

He really is a bit of a puzzle, I only learned of him recently and thought he was Scottish, so the badge was a bit of a shock.

I now know that he was born c 1900 married in 1941 (that's his wedding foto) and he died in Glasgow in 1985).

His full name was William Spence Walker

He would have a service record, probably viewable online: http://naa12.naa.gov.au/Login.htm (select 'guest' to log in) - There are over 200 Walker records, so you will need to do a bit of trawling through to ID your man. It will help if you can uncover any additional info on him - where born, birth date, etc.

I agree that his wristwatch appears to be a converted pocket watch, and possibly with a protective cover, making it a 'trench watch'.

Ian

Mmany thanks Ian

[J T Gray]

Given the tendency of the Scots to travel far and wide, you shouldn't be surprised - he ma well have emigrated and joined up over there. I have a Dundonian ANZAC in my family!

I have to say, though, that I am cynical about the dates. Unless he's very well preserved, I'm not convinced that he's 41 (plus a couple - if was born in 1900, he'd have been pushing it to make it into the AIF in time to be wounded twice, so I suspect late 1890s is a better bet). I'm also not convinced that that is a 1940s blouse behind him, and why would he be in what looks to my (not very experienced) eye to be a WW1 uniform then?

Assuming it is the right chap (sorry to seem hard, I've done it myself more than once and I know how easy it is to bark up the wrong part of the family tree), could he have married for a second time in 1941, and this be a first wedding?

Could you post the rest of the picture - other people's fashions might give us a clue as to the date?

Adrian

[wainfleet]

That photo was definitely not taken in 1941, so you are in the right place! The wound stripes and service stripes were abolished some time in the early twenties. It looks like a WW1 uniform, and his watch also looks very much of the time. And as Michelle has said, the ladies' fashions are wrong for the 40s. Plus I v much doubt that this man is 41 - he looks as if he has been through a lot, but he still looks young.

Are you absolutely sure that this is your G Uncle? If it is, then I would put that picture at a guess in early 1919, on his return home from the war.

Regards,

W.

[Tom Buchan]

Given the tendency of the Scots to travel far and wide, you shouldn't be surprised - he ma well have emigrated and joined up over there. I have a Dundonian ANZAC in my family!

I have to say, though, that I am cynical about the dates. Unless he's very well preserved, I'm not convinced that he's 41 (plus a couple - if was born in 1900, he'd have been pushing it to make it into the AIF in time to be wounded twice, so I suspect late 1890s is a better bet). I'm also not convinced that that is a 1940s blouse behind him, and why would he be in what looks to my (not very experienced) eye to be a WW1 uniform then?

Assuming it is the right chap (sorry to seem hard, I've done it myself more than once and I know how easy it is to bark up the wrong part of the family tree), could he have married for a second time in 1941, and this be a first wedding?

Could you post the rest of the picture - other people's fashions might give us a clue as to the date?

Adrian

[Tom Buchan]

Firstly 1,000 apologies from an inexperienced user. My query relates to my great uncle William Walker. I know precious little about him other than this foto which was taken in 1941 and from my research appears to show his collar badge as the Australian Commonwealth forces. My understanding is that he was born and raised in Scotland?

Any idea which regiment and what is that on his wrist?

I agree with the comments about his age etc, and it appears I may have been mislead

Full foto is too large to attach Sorry!

[Michelle Young]

You could put it on an external site like photobucket then post a link, quite a few people do that.

Cheers, Michelle

[Tom Buchan]

You could put it on an external site like photobucket then post a link, quite a few people do that.

Cheers, Michelle

Thank you again Michelle

[ian turner]

If you have scan of the full photo all you need to do is to reduce the file size down to less than 100kb so that you can post it here.

Ian

[Peter Doyle]

Without question, this photo (which is superb) if of Great war vintage. I agree with all that's been said above, and particularly like the 'trench watch' on his wrist. Wristwatches really came into their own in the First World War - although used in the Boer war too, they had previously been considered as somewhat effeminate, but the needs of trench warfare meant that pocket watches were sometimes less easy to use, and more easy to lose. What's great is the metal guard over the watch glass, intended to protect it from being broken. The wound badges and overseas service stripes, and the clothing of the ladies all support the diagnosis, as discussed above.

Best wishes

Peter

[Tom Buchan]

Without question, this photo (which is superb) if of Great war vintage. I agree with all that's been said above, and particularly like the 'trench watch' on his wrist. Wristwatches really came into their own in the First World War - although used in the Boer war too, they had previously been considered as somewhat effeminate, but the needs of trench warfare meant that pocket watches were sometimes less easy to use, and more easy to lose. What's great is the metal guard over the watch glass, intended to protect it from being broken. The wound badges and overseas service stripes, and the clothing of the ladies all support the diagnosis, as discussed above.

Best wishes

Peter

Peter believe it or not, and I know it appears bizarre, this is his wedding foto to my aunt Isa Kerr taken in 1941 (perhaps why the foto is so good). William Spence Walker was born in 1901 in Glasgow and did not marry until he was 40!!

The other two in the foto best man and best maid (her sister) married in 1933. you can see his wedding ring.

I can only guess he went to Australia as a young man.

I need my son to alter the image before I can resend.

I'm an old **** who hasn't mastered the computer!

[wainfleet]

Hi TMB

Not wishing to seem impolite, but your family must have got this photo confused with another one. This man has seen service since 1916. He would have had to have enlisted illegally at 15, which is possible but extremely rare, and survived the very thorough comb-outs of underage troops that took place in 1918. Plus there is all the other evidence that has already been pointed out. Realistically, this photo can only date from 1941 if all the participants took place in some sort of elaborate fancy dress charade, and why would they want to do that for an event like a wedding? Got to be a mistake here.

With best wishes,

W.

[Tom Buchan]

Hi TMB

Not wishing to seem impolite, but your family must have got this photo confused with another one. This man has seen service since 1916. He would have had to have enlisted illegally at 15, which is possible but extremely rare, and survived the very thorough comb-outs of underage troops that took place in 1918. Plus there is all the other evidence that has already been pointed out. Realistically, this photo can only date from 1941 if all the participants took place in some sort of elaborate fancy dress charade, and why would they want to do that for an event like a wedding? Got to be a mistake here.

With best wishes,

W.

No offence taken W. It is proving to be a real nightmare. The foto shows him arm in aunt with my aunt. Her sister is in the foto with her husband. they married in 1933!

I understand from family folklore that he was a bit of a rascal. If the foto was taken in 1941 could he have 2 years service by then!!!

I have his mariage cert and I now know all about his parents, and am at a loss to establish any Australian connection.

I can't find any record of him leaving the UK or returning.

[ian turner]

Just joining in with the 'it must be a mistake in dates' chorus! The full image will be interesting, but meantime to ask you for sake of clarification.

Do you recognise the man as your uncle - did you know him?

Presumably you knew your aunt?

Do you recognise the sister and her husband of 1933?

If not, then are you taking this info from hearsay?

All the visual evidence points to a WW1 era photo, so did your aunt have a previous marriage? Or is it your aunt's parent's marriage?

Finally - where are all our Aussie pals when you need them? (Probably suffering from the heat...)

Ian

[Tom Buchan]

Just joining in with the 'it must be a mistake in dates' chorus! The full image will be interesting, but meantime to ask you for sake of clarification.

Do you recognise the man as your uncle - did you know him?

Presumably you knew your aunt?

Do you recognise the sister and her husband of 1933?

If not, then are you taking this info from hearsay?

All the visual evidence points to a WW1 era photo, so did your aunt have a previous marriage? Or is it your aunt's parent's marriage?

Finally - where are all our Aussie pals when you need them? (Probably suffering from the heat...)

Ian

It is definitely my aunt and her sister who as I said married in 1933. A pal with an interest in Photography has assured me the quality of the foto is way after WW!. He reckons definitely after 1930. As aforesaid I accept all the comments questioning the origin of the foto. (I am not oversensitive and understand all the queries. He does not look 40 to me, although the man in the back of the foto aged 41 does look 41.

I am left wondering if he could have joined at 17 say in the first war and then re-enlilsted for WW2. Having said that I cant find his record! Is he wearing a WW1 uniform. If he is and the foto is clearly after 1933 why would he wear it between wars?

Your guess is as good as mine.

PS I appreciate the assistance I have had from all the respondents.

Regards

TMB

[Rockdoc]

Is it a wedding ring or a signet ring he's wearing? It's on his little finger, not the third finger. It would be unusual, as far as I'm concerned, for men to wear wedding rings up to the sixties, in the UK at least. Neither of my grandfathers did, nor did my father or father-in-law who both married in 1948. I married in 1971 and it was still considered a bit strange when I wore one.

I'm afraid I'm with everyone else. I think this may well have been taken on his home-coming in 1919/1920. Photographic quality shouldn't be an issue with the slow emulsions of the time and if, as it looks, it was taken by a professional it will have been good from the start. The negative would have been a large one and the image possibly being reduced in the print rather than being enlarged so it will be very crisp.

Keith

[ian turner]

It is definitely my aunt and her sister

But is it definitely your uncle? And is it definitely your aunt's sister's husband?

We love a mystery on the Great War Forum, heck we even make mysteries when none previously existed....

Anyway, I am not trying to play the advocat just to look smart, but to try and find out what you actually know as opposed to what you have been told or assumed. For example it may well be your aunt and her sister, but appearing here with some friends or boyfriends or brothers (?) or even previous husbands from an earlier period.

We should now hold our breath until the larger picture is posted, and then resume the guesswork!

Ian

[Tom Buchan]

Is it a wedding ring or a signet ring he's wearing? It's on his little finger, not the third finger. It would be unusual, as far as I'm concerned, for men to wear wedding rings up to the sixties, in the UK at least. Neither of my grandfathers did, nor did my father or father-in-law who both married in 1948. I married in 1971 and it was still considered a bit strange when I wore one.

I'm afraid I'm with everyone else. I think this may well have been taken on his home-coming in 1919/1920. Photographic quality shouldn't be an issue with the slow emulsions of the time and if, as it looks, it was taken by a professional it will have been good from the start. The negative would have been a large one and the image possibly being reduced in the print rather than being enlarged so it will be very crisp.

Keith

Many thanks Keith

I'm concluding that the information re the foto which I got from an 84 year old uncle is to say the least questionable!

The date is obviously wrong.

If it is a post WW1 foto I am hopeful that I will be able to trace the military record of William Spence Walker born 2.4.1901 in Glasgow and how he joined the AIF