Guest Posted 24 January , 2009 Share Posted 24 January , 2009 My Dad had a document awarded to him (168235 Gr. Stephen M. Hall C/180 Bde RFA) for "gallant conduct" on June 7, 1917 and signed by Major General W.B. Hickie commanding the 16th Irish Division. I understand The Irish Division was engaged in the Messine campaign at this time. I have searched without success to out find more about this. I was told that he and another gunner went into no-man's land and rescued two wounded, during the second rescue my father's comrade was killed by a sniper and the officer in charge ordered my Dad to make that enough before he too was killed. What I have from Ancestry makes no mention of this event, that part of his record was proabably lost amongst the burnt records. My research shows that the 180th was raised in West Ham. My Dad was from Newport, Mon. he was transfered to the West Ham brigade at some point, I have a story about that which I'll tell another time! I was told that the Irish Division records are hard to uncover, something to do with the Irish "troubles" in the 1920's. Any ideas or advice about this mystery would be most appreciated. Dad did do something special and I would dearly love to know for sure what it was. He himself would not talk about it - it came with the rations, was all he would say. Thanks, Steve's Daughter, Kathy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desmond7 Posted 24 January , 2009 Share Posted 24 January , 2009 He would have received a card like the one below .. around about the same size. Conduct cards were issued by Divisions for various reasons .. the most common being that the Division may well have put a man forward for an award but the powers that be decided against full award. This was a bit of an annoyance so in some divisions a conduct card was issued instead. It should also be remembered that there was a 'quota' system in operation for medals (as far as I know) .. thus you could, in theory commit an act worthy of (e.g.) a MM but it could be 'shot down' due to quota exhaustion. June 7 1917 is indeed the date of Messines attack. 36th (Ulster) and 16th (Irish) attacke side by side at Wytescaete, Belgiu,. It was in western front terms a hugely wellk planned and successful attack mememorable for the explosion of gigantic mines. Interestingly, the Ulster Division's original artillery was recruited around West Ham! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ulsterlad2 Posted 24 January , 2009 Share Posted 24 January , 2009 Hi Kathy. Just an idea. Have you checked to see if the 180 (CLXXX) Brigade Royal Field Artillery war diaries are at TNA Kew? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 24 January , 2009 Share Posted 24 January , 2009 He would have received a card like the one below .. around about the same size. Conduct cards were issued by Divisions for various reasons .. the most common being that the Division may well have put a man forward for an award but the powers that be decided against full award. This was a bit of an annoyance so in some divisions a conduct card was issued instead. It should also be remembered that there was a 'quota' system in operation for medals (as far as I know) .. thus you could, in theory commit an act worthy of (e.g.) a MM but it could be 'shot down' due to quota exhaustion. June 7 1917 is indeed the date of Messines attack. 36th (Ulster) and 16th (Irish) attacke side by side at Wytescaete, Belgiu,. It was in western front terms a hugely wellk planned and successful attack mememorable for the explosion of gigantic mines. Interestingly, the Ulster Division's original artillery was recruited around West Ham! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 24 January , 2009 Share Posted 24 January , 2009 He would have received a card like the one below .. around about the same size. Conduct cards were issued by Divisions for various reasons .. the most common being that the Division may well have put a man forward for an award but the powers that be decided against full award. This was a bit of an annoyance so in some divisions a conduct card was issued instead. It should also be remembered that there was a 'quota' system in operation for medals (as far as I know) .. thus you could, in theory commit an act worthy of (e.g.) a MM but it could be 'shot down' due to quota exhaustion. June 7 1917 is indeed the date of Messines attack. 36th (Ulster) and 16th (Irish) attacke side by side at Wytescaete, Belgiu,. It was in western front terms a hugely wellk planned and successful attack mememorable for the explosion of gigantic mines. Interestingly, the Ulster Division's original artillery was recruited around West Ham! Thanks for the info..I do remember being told that there might have been a MM recomended, but if such decorations were to be given every time one was deserved there would be so many the medals would lose their meaning, hence the quota system. I do have a conduct card for Dad that is where I got the details. It looks very much like the one you show, but was typed not printed. I did not know they were called conduct cards. Thanks for telling me that. Kathy - Steve's daughter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 24 January , 2009 Share Posted 24 January , 2009 Hi Kathy. Just an idea. Have you checked to see if the 180 (CLXXX) Brigade Royal Field Artillery war diaries are at TNA Kew? Hi Ulsterlad, I haven't checked the TNA personally, but a researcher I paid to check for my Dad's records some years ago, before they were available on Ancestry did, and found nothing at that time. So much more has been released since and I'll certainly look into it. Thanks Kathy - Steve's Daughter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deerdiver Posted 13 June , 2023 Share Posted 13 June , 2023 I'm currently in the process of transcribing the War Diary of 180 Bde RFA into a word document. Its taking a while! My Grandfather served with B Battery, 180 Bde Royal Field Artillery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deerdiver Posted 6 February Share Posted 6 February The entry in 180 Bde RFA War Diary for 07 June 1917 Reads " 07 June 1917 Attack on WYTSCHAETE began at 03:10 AM and all objectives taken up to BLACK LINE 500 yds East of WYTSCHAETE taken by 08:30 AM. 180th Bde RFA got the order to advance to positions near MAEDELSTEDE FARM in “No Man’s Land” N.24c IRISH HOUSE N.23.C.9.5 Headquarters at IRISH HOUSE N.23.C.9.5. Advance on OOSTTAVERNE LINE commenced at 03:10 PM. Successful. Ops established at WYTSCHAETE RIDGE. ROCKET GUARD near WYTSCHAETE CHURCH. Visual Signalling Stations at CHURCH and lip of MAEDELSTEDE CRATER. Location of Infantry Front Line reported at 12:00 midnight by 2/Lt. F.E DAVY (Advanced Intellig. Offr.) 2/Lt. B.G. LEE D/180 Wounded (GSW) (to hospital) " My Grandfather was also in "C" Battery 180th Brigade RFA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteStarLine Posted 7 February Share Posted 7 February @Deerdiver many of these specialist artillery maps are in TrenchMapper. The Messines Barrage Map shows the 0310 barrage control timings and report lines such as the Black Line (extreme right). Positions occupied after 0830 are also marked. Click to enlarge. Credits: (SPECIAL) 1:10,000 MAP 8150/2 Sheet 28 SW 2 [parts of] 1:10,000 Edition: 29/05/1917 Secret 2nd Army Barrage Map June 1917. Printed Jun-17 Map Id: ma_000700 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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