alex falbo Posted 13 January , 2009 Share Posted 13 January , 2009 Hello all.... This officer has been a long time in coming as WWI is poorly represented in the 1/6 market at best! I used a WWII staff officer tunic as the basis for conversion to a WWI officers SD tunic. This involved a colour repaint to a drab shade which most of my resources (Chappel plates, original tunics for sale, and other colour photos) have indicated is the correct shade. The cuffs were made from scratch. The pips lack detail and the lace should be a a dull gold trimming but this feature still requires attention (working as I type). His breeches were also a pale khaki as of the early war type. I painted them a darker brown as photos indicate was more practical in trench warfare. My question regards the nature of the overall appearance of a line officer from late 1916 to the Armistice and if there are any glaring errors. I realize that the holster is that used by Lewis gunners and enlisted men, but was it at all common for officers to wear them too? He is missing his respirator but he's coming back from a night trench patrol. (I have respirators for all the lads so don't worry about that essential piece) Here's a shot of the above in a scene. The detail is often restricted by the aging of the pic in photoshop but I still want as much accuracy in the figures as possible. Many thanks for looking. Pick Away !!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gonville Posted 13 January , 2009 Share Posted 13 January , 2009 First off, great model - I almost do not wish to be critical, but as you've asked... Not seen officers wearing open topped holsters, I'm afraid. The only other real error I can see is the colour of the rank insignia - should be about the same "khaki" colour and constructions as OR's rank chevrons. That said, I'm very colour blind, so it may be khaki and I'm just seeing it as white! For a Lt, only one ring round the sleeve, too. A couple of things I'd put down as not errors as such, but unlikely. By this time, I'd expect a wind up (shoulder rank) tunic to be more common then cuff rank. Also, officers in the line pretty much seemed to have abadoned the Sam Browne rig in combat (I have a feeling this was ordered from 1915 onwards), wearing OR's 08 in pistol order, various adaptations of 08 webbing, or mills officers webbing. The Lanyard would usually go under the eppaullettes, although I'm not sure how acheivable this would be with a model. Being really anal, I'd expect his boots to be laced "flat", not the way you've shewn. That said, it's hard to be critical when I know that if I were to try something like this, it would end up looking like the officer in question had visited a mechanic as opposed to a tailor! Very, very good, and I wish I had the talent! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wainfleet Posted 13 January , 2009 Share Posted 13 January , 2009 By this time, I'd expect a wind up (shoulder rank) tunic to be more common then cuff rank. Also, officers in the line pretty much seemed to have abadoned the Sam Browne rig in combat (I have a feeling this was ordered from 1915 onwards), wearing OR's 08 in pistol order, various adaptations of 08 webbing, or mills officers webbing. Sorry, but this just isn't true. There have been numerous discussions on it here, but the myth just won't die. Photographic evidence shows that officers continued to wear cuff rank at the front for the entire war. If anything, it was seen more than shoulder rank. The same applies to the Sam Browne belt. I can't see the pictures on this machine, so can't comment on the models, but shades of officer tunic khaki varied considerably, though tending always to greenish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Upton Posted 13 January , 2009 Share Posted 13 January , 2009 Generally good again, however as said the braid on the cuffs should basically be the same stuff used on rank chevrons - the brown/orange tape with the woven white V's in it, not plain white (and not a hint of gold to be found). For Lieutenant (two pips) it should only have one horizontal rank of braid going around the cuff, not two as shown (which would be for a Captain with three pips). As for the webbing, sometimes in the field Officers can be seen wearing a mish-mash of kit, ranging from dressed in full Officer kit right down to the standard full OR's kit with pips on the shoulder being the only concession to their rank, and everything in between. For my money, given the rest of his standard Officer kit, I would give him the Officers ammunition pouch and covered holster, rather than the open-top holster and relevant pouch. As I have Officers kit for living history purposes, I can take a few pictures of my cuff rank tunic, Sam Browne and accessories, or anything else if it would be helpful? You might also find the link below helpful: http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/i...609&hl=cuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gonville Posted 13 January , 2009 Share Posted 13 January , 2009 Sorry, but this just isn't true. There have been numerous discussions on it here, but the myth just won't die. Photographic evidence shows that officers continued to wear cuff rank at the front for the entire war. If anything, it was seen more than shoulder rank. The same applies to the Sam Browne belt. I can't see the pictures on this machine, so can't comment on the models, but shades of officer tunic khaki varied considerably, though tending always to greenish. Whilst I agree that cuff rank was worn throughout the war (I've not seen any photo's of any non-infantrymen, excluding obvious exceptions, wearing shoulder rank), my primary reason for mentioning wind up tunics was that it struck me as perhaps a more practical option for model making then multicoloured worsted insignia. That said, it did vary by regiment. With regards webbing vs. Sam Browne, all the photographs I've seen of officers wearing Sam Brownes in the firing lines is in contexts that strike me as being a very quiet section of the line, where nothing is expected to happen. This unfortunately, is the vast majority of photographs - hardly suprising, really, as they would hardly allow photographs to be taken in the heat of a large offensive. There was certainly an order given, suprisingly early in the war (I think it was early 1915, or maybe even very late 14IIRC), that officers should wear webbing, and it should be recovered from casualties. Of course, officers were (and to a certain extent are) somewhat renowned for the lack of adherence to dress instructions, unless an adjutant was about! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alex falbo Posted 13 January , 2009 Author Share Posted 13 January , 2009 Thanks for the info so far. Keep it coming. Changes will be made so I'll post again. "my primary reason for mentioning wind up tunics was that it struck me as perhaps a more practical option for model making then multicoloured worsted insignia" Its pertinent to mention that building WWI in this scale is very challenging with the limited supplies available. My friend Tony Barton has stated this also when displaying his models for critique on this forum. I'm interested in getting it right no matter the limitations to what the hobby or materials offer. It seems the SD tunics are getting harder to locate so I'm might take up sewing soon in order to make them from scratch. Andrew, some pics of your set up would me most welcomed!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Upton Posted 14 January , 2009 Share Posted 14 January , 2009 Andrew, some pics of your set up would me most welcomed!![/color] Hopefully these should be of help/interest, I have some more but it keeps trying to merge subsequent posts at the moment and not let me post any more of the links. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Upton Posted 14 January , 2009 Share Posted 14 January , 2009 The pictures are a mixture of my cuff rank and wind-up tunics - cuff rank is for best, wind-up has been heavily modified for heavy use and to be less conspicuous to a degree: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Upton Posted 14 January , 2009 Share Posted 14 January , 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Upton Posted 14 January , 2009 Share Posted 14 January , 2009 Heres the last of them - any more specific details needed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alex falbo Posted 14 January , 2009 Author Share Posted 14 January , 2009 MANY thanks Andrew. Those will do nicely. I'll be sure to post with improvements. Wonderful impression. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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