2nd Battalion OTAGO Regiment N.Z.

[west coast]

hi again ,

i`v just been reading the diaries and i was a little mistaken earlier, lieut simon was indeed attached to 2nd otago regt in the 10th coy [also 8th coy ]. there are no maps for this area at that time , but he has a lot of entries on events prior to and after the 7th june.

mike.

[TEW]

Swift1914,

I found what I thought was a very good history of NZ Div and 2nd Otago at;

http://library.christchurch.org.nz/Heritag...AndFlanders.pdf

It is a modern Pilgrimage with lots of history and maps. My interest relates to the 2nd Otago at Mormal Forest Nov 1918 who flanked the 62nd division.

TW

[vrijdag13]

Swift1914,

I found what I thought was a very good history of NZ Div and 2nd Otago at;

http://library.christchurch.org.nz/Heritag...AndFlanders.pdf

It is a modern Pilgrimage with lots of history and maps. My interest relates to the 2nd Otago at Mormal Forest Nov 1918 who flanked the 62nd division.

TW

Thank you very much...Yes indeed it's a great work...

I saw the book last year when I was in New Zealand and I know that the writer is working on a new edition...

[vrijdag13]

On the 6th of Juin we will remember Arthur Earl Collie at Messines Ridge Cemetry.

[grumpleweed]

Anyone have any info on the 2nd Battalion OTAGO Regiment, New Zealand?

I know that they were at Bulford Camp presumably training sometime during 1916.

Where did they go from there?

Any help much appreciated

There is a copy of the official history online at http://nzetc.victoria.ac.nz/tm/scholarly/tei-WH1-Otag.html which covers its formation and embarkation to the end of the war. I had a great uncle who was in the 8th Company, 2nd Battalion who was mortally wounded in the Second Battle of the Somme (March 1918) somewhere around Colincamps and Mailly Maillet. The Otago regiment (including the 8th Bn) was part of the NZ contingent who forced marched to plug a gap in the line as a result of the German spring offensive. At the and I am trying to get a more accurate location as to where he was on the 28th when he was wounded. As I am in Wellington I am looking at seeing if the archives have a copy of the war diaries for the unit.

[jacksdad]

The archives have the war diary

2 Otago can be ordered up on WA 80-1

if your relative was wounded on the 28 March - 2 Otago was holding the 'purple line' this was a new trench dug by the pioneers and at that date still being dug. the purple line was a reserve trench which ran along about 1500 -2000 yards behind the frontline.

On the 28th March 2 Otago came under 'heavy' shellfire around Colincamps and this was the day that the Brig Gen Fulton was killed when the NZRB HQ at Colincamps was hit.

On the 29th the 2Otago moved just south to Englebelmer

prior to this on the 26th they arrived at Amiens then by lorry to Hedauville and then marched with the 3NZRB and 2 Wellington at 1am arriving at Colincamps 4am on the 27th.

If you want a copy of this date i can email it to you.

Cheers Roger

[grumpleweed]

Thanks Roger. I was in the archives today and read the original war diary and looked at the map of the purple line. The only thing I find slightly perplexing is that his wound was recorded in his records as GSW which I interpret as gun shot wound. Given they were in a more rear position, though still only 1500 to 2000 yards behind the the frontline, and the heavy shelling they experienced, I would have expected the wound to be by shellfire, not gun shot.

[jacksdad]

Hi

GSW is as you say 'Gun Shot wound'

but if you have a squize at the NZ files on line 'everyone' died of GSW...

It was the easy answer, for the doctors filling out the forms in the ADS or Base hospitals when they really had only the wound to go by.

So GSW really is just the default cause of death or cause of wound, thats not to say that it wasn't the cause, some military files have great detail and others - well it needs to be taken with a 'grain of salt'.

Bear in mind also that by the time 'some' of these poor blokes actually got seen too their wounds were less than fresh and in the odd occasion septic to boot. The poor medic or doctor, like my grandfather pictured here, is trying to clear 20 more patients then he really has time for and - well the paper work is not as important...

its just like a good number of KIA have 'in the field of France' or words to that effect - even when they were killed in Belgium.

what was his name?

Roger

[grumpleweed]

Robert James Wright. He lived about two weeks after getting wounded so I suspect it was a post wound infection or maybe fat embolism. With fracturs of the femor the death rate was very high (I've read up to 80% at the start of WW1), in the first instance due haemorraghic shock, then later due to infection or embolisms. Antibiotics came only after the war so treatment of infections was still very primitive. Even today fractures of the femor can be life threatening even with all the advances in medicine and drugs, particulalry for the elderly, so I am not surprised that it had such a high fatality rate a centuray ago.

[Flea]

Can anyone please help me with research on my Great Grandfather: Hugh Henry MASTERS

Here is what I know:

He served in the 2nd Otago Battalion as a "CQMS" which I understand is Company Quartermaster Sergeant: http://bit.ly/OKnQIl

According to his Military Record which I ordered from NZ Defence Force, he was in Sling Camp for 2 years, then went to Etaples in France on 18 September 1918. He was with the 10th Company (North Otago). He was with the 2nd Battalion through until 1919 as they made their way through France, Belgium, occupied Germany, then back to London.

Here is what I would like to know:

(1) What did a CQMS do? Was he based at HQ looking after supplies etc, or out with the rest of the Battalion?

(2) As a CQMS, I understand he is not an Officer, but is there a possibility he is in this photo: http://bit.ly/OKosOb My mother says she thinks he might be in the bottom right of the first row (I explained he wasn't an Officer but she says it might be him).

Thanks for any help!

[Flea]

Is the soldier front right my Great Grandfather? Is he the 2nd Battalion Otago CQMS?

[Wendy Macpherson]

flea

Hi and welcome to the forum.

If I were you I would start a new thread with your inquiry as I think it will get overlooked on the bottom of this old one.

I have quiet a few diaries and will see what I have of the Otago Regiment, will have a read.

Do you live near Wellington to get access to all the diaries for the Otago's.

The only thing that stands out to me about the photo is that all the men are wearing jodhpurs, would that indicate that they are mounted??

Wendy

Edited 7 September , 2012 by Wendy Mac...

[jacksdad]

Hi Flea

Does his military file state the date he was "in the Field"?

do you have a photo of him other than this one you have posted, maybe you could compare the photos?

Cheers Roger

[Flea]

Hi Wendy and Roger. Thanks for the feedback. I just looked at the file again (see attached). I think it does show "field". It says:

Record: Appointed Temporary CQMS (Vice 8/3273 CQMS R Gillespie ....)

Place: Field

Date: 23.9.18

Record: Prom CQMS

Place: Field

Date: 23.9.18

Record: Embarked for NZ ...

Place: London

Date: 18.7.19

In his WWII record he declared that he had been in France, Belgium and Germany until June 1919.

Wendy - I am in the US for the next 2 years, I will be back in Wellington for 2 days in December. Perhaps that would be a good time to look at the Otago diaries?

Roger - Im trying to find some old photos to match, but Im not sure we have any. That is why I was so interested in finding out if a CQMS would be in a photo with Officers, because my mother thought it looked like him. What is the significance of the "field" reference?

HHM.tiff

[jacksdad]

Hi

in the field would indicate when he was serving with the battn and if he was around when the photo was taken.

which this information now confirms he was

cheers roger