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kesannah

Kings Royal Rifle Corps

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kesannah

I have a family member whose original enlistment and discharge paper is in my possession.

He enlisted on 9 Dec.1915 and was a Rifleman. He was wounded by a gunshot wound to the head.I know that his wife was able to visit him in hospital in France, as he was not expected to live. However he did survive was discharged in16 Sept. 1918 and lived until 1980.

Is there anyway I can find out when and where he would have been fighting and what battalion he was with. I have his medal card but it does not give those details.

Any help would be appreciated.

Kesannah

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kesannah

I forgot to ask if there is any way I can find out where he was when he was wounded and/or which Hospital he would have been taken to for treatment.

Kesannah

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jay dubaya

Hi Kesannah,

a name and number would be jolly useful,

Jon

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kesannah

Thankyou for your reply Jon

The details you have asked for are

Thomas William Henry Bentley.

Regiment No. R22149

Kesannah

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MBrockway

Kesannah,

Here are the details on his Medal Index Card ...

BENTLEY, Thomas W., King's Royal Rifle Corps, Pte, R.22149

Victory & British War Medal Roll M/101B/28 Page 3576

Silver War Badge List M/1100 (shews T.W.H.Bentley)

Discharged 16 Sep 1918

There's no Embarkation Date, nor anything else, so I'll not post the actual image.

Service Number R/22149 would suggest one of the Kitchener Service battalions before 16th Battalion - i.e. 7th to 13th battalions - but this is by no means conclusive.

The only reliable way of identifying his battalion is by a look up on the actual Medal Roll mentioned on his Medal Index Card. Unfortunately these are not available on-line and I do not have my own copy. The Silver War Badge Roll should also give an enlistment date.

You'll have to hope that one of the other KRRC/RB Pals spots this and comes up with the goods ... failing that, you'll need to get to Kew to look it up yourself!

Once we've identified his KRRC battalion, we should be able to help with further info on the movements of that battalion.

Cheers,

Mark

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kesannah

Mark, Thankyou very much for your reply. Is the only way I can look up the Silver Ward Badge Roll by paying a visit to Kew?

Unfortunately I am unable to go to Kew .

Kesannah.

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MBrockway
Mark, Thankyou very much for your reply. Is the only way I can look up the Silver Ward Badge Roll by paying a visit to Kew?

Unfortunately I am unable to go to Kew .

Kesannah.

Kesannah,

Several of the Pals here with interest in the KRRC and the Rifle Brigade have personal copies of the KRRC and RB SWB rolls as well as the rolls for the 1914 and 1915 Stars, the British War Medal and the Victory Medal .... unfortunately I don't - yet! LOL!

If you're lucky, one of these Pals will spot this and help you out B)

Cheers,

Mark

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kesannah

Mark ,

Thankyou, I am quite a novice with Military history, and as in the case of my Uncle who was in 1/9 QVTs and died in France, I appreciate the information given to me by people on this forum.

Kesannah

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stiletto_33853

Kesannah,

Thomas W.H. Bentley enlisted on the 9/12/15 and discharged due to wounds on the 16/9/18 under Kings Regulations 392(xvi) aged 25 years and 234 days. He was issued Silver War Badge number B12461.

Andy

post-1871-1226257915.jpg

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kesannah

Andy,

Thankyou very much for the information you have sent me.

I am very grateful.

Regards

Kesannah

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MBrockway
Kesannah,

If you're lucky, one of these Pals will spot this and help you out B)

Cheers,

Mark

Kesannah,

It was Andy I was hoping would be able to help with the Silver War Badge Roll ... and sure enough he's come up trumps as always!

Other Pals have access to the KRRC British War/Victory Medal rolls - that's the one that should tell us his battalions. Today is a busy day for most of the Pals, so they've most likely not spotted this yet B)

Fingers crossed!

Cheers,

Mark

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stiletto_33853

I cannot help you with the KRRC Rolls, have all the RB's bot not the KRRC's.

Andy

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shinglma

Kesannah

If I have time I will look up the British War & Victory Medal Roll whilst at Kew tomorrow.

Regards

Mike S

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kesannah

Mike S,

Many thanks to you . I really appreciate it.

I hope you have a good day at Kew regardless of whether or not you have time to do a look up for me.

Regards

Kesannah

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shinglma
I hope you have a good day at Kew regardless of whether or not you have time to do a look up for me.

Kesannah

I've only just about dried out. :wacko: Trust me not to check the weather forecast. Actually it was a very good day researchwise at Kew:

post-627-1226338450.jpg

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shinglma

As you can see he served with 21st KRRC. If you would like a copy of the full page photo (it only includes the information shown here) send me a PM with your email address.

Regards

Mike S

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MBrockway
As you can see he served with 21st KRRC. If you would like a copy of the full page photo (it only includes the information shown here) send me a PM with your email address.

Regards

Mike S

Kesannah,

Of course Mike was the other Pal I was hoping would help you out :rolleyes: , so now thanks to him we know Rfn Thomas Bentley was in 21st (Service) Battalion (Yeoman Rifles) King's Royal Rifle Corps.

We've got a Topic running at the moment on the Yeoman Rifles here: Looking for further information, Rfn Frank Arnold, 21st [Yeoman Rifles]Kings Royal Rifle Corps

You'll find a lot of background to this excellent unit there.

Meanwhile do you have any clue as to how long before discharge he might have been wounded? We can then start to bracket off a period to look for a possible Action where it happened. I should warn you though, it's very difficult to trace that sort of thing at the individual level.

Cheers,

Mark

PS Big thanks to Mike!

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shinglma

Kesannah

As Mark says you'll find a lot about 21/KRRC on the other topic. There is a small memorial to them in the market place in Helmsley North Yorkshire (where the battalion was originally raised). I've attached a photo I took a few years back:

post-627-1226344026.jpg

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kesannah

Mike, I am pleased to hear that your day at Kew was a good one despite getting a soaking.

It has certainly been good from my point of view and I thank you for your time and effort on my behalf.

I have printed the images on the screen, so a full page pic is not necessary(if it shows the same information), but thanks for the offer.

Mark, I shall have a look at the link you posted as I definitely would like to learn more about this unit.

Unfortunately I do not know how long after being wounded he was discharged. He joined up 6 weeks after his marriage

and I know his eldest child was born in August of 1916. I presume(rightly or wrongly) that he went to France after that date.

He was not one for talking about his experiences and it was only from his brother than I knew he was wounded seriously.

There is no one left in the family that I could ask either. I wouldn't have imagined it would be very long between being injured and being discharged but who knows what happened in those terrible times.

Kesannah.

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MBrockway
Mark, I shall have a look at the link you posted as I definitely would like to learn more about this unit.

Unfortunately I do not know how long after being wounded he was discharged. He joined up 6 weeks after his marriage

and I know his eldest child was born in August of 1916. I presume(rightly or wrongly) that he went to France after that date.

He was not one for talking about his experiences and it was only from his brother than I knew he was wounded seriously.

There is no one left in the family that I could ask either. I wouldn't have imagined it would be very long between being injured and being discharged but who knows what happened in those terrible times.

Kesannah.

Kesannah,

21st (Yeoman Rifles) KRRC were in 124th Brigade within the 41st Division.

Confirming his exact date of wounding is going to prove very difficult.

In the meantime you can get an idea of the actions that 21/KRRC were involved in by looking at the 41st Division page on the Mother site here: The 41st Division in 1914-1918

You'll need to give it a few days though as Chris Baker is still busy converting these pages to the format for the re-vamped version of the site. Keep checking back!

As regards what we can surmise from the limited information we have so far ...

Rfn Thomas BENTLEY, 21/KRRC

  • enlisted 9th December 1915 (probably under the Derby Scheme - do a Search for that on the Mother site)
  • eldest son conceived approx Dec 1915
  • not entitled to 1914-15 Star so definitely not in a theatre of war before end of 1915 (that's not surprising if he only enlisted in mid December!)
  • eldest son born Aug 1916
  • discharged due to wounds 16 Sep 1918

I don't think it's safe to assume Thomas would have been allowed to stay back until his child was born - the need for men at the Front would have taken priority :huh:

However, as a raw recruit he would have needed at least three months training, probably more like six to nine months, so I think it unlikely that he was sent to France & Flanders before Easter 1916, and it is quite possible he was still in Blighty when his son was born.

Another Pal might have better information on the time between enlisting and embarkation at this stage of the war. Remember that by 1916 some training was being delivered in France.

Also the date of discharge is not necessarily soon after the date of wounding. Men would be given time to recover from even very serious wounds to see if they would become once again useful to the Army. This could mean as a fighting infantryman if he returned to A1 Fitness, or a transfer to the Labour Corps or one of the other rear area units if he was not quite A1, or it could mean a posting to a Depot job in England if he would not be capable of manual labour.

Discharge could be months or even years after the actual wounding.

Cheers,

Mark

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kesannah

Hello Mark,

My apologies for not answering soon. I have not been on the site for a few days.

I thank you for giving me the information and where to look for the actions they were involved in.

I shall certainly follow this up. I appreciate your help.

Regards

Kesannah

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MBrockway
Hello Mark,

My apologies for not answering soon. I have not been on the site for a few days.

I thank you for giving me the information and where to look for the actions they were involved in.

I shall certainly follow this up. I appreciate your help.

Regards

Kesannah

Kesannah,

As an alternative until Chris gets the Order of Battle pages moved across, you could use this site: The Regimental Warpath - 41st Division: History and Order of Battle

However it shouldn't be long now before the Mother site's page is available again.

Cheers,

Mark

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MBrockway
Mark ,

Thankyou, I am quite a novice with Military history, and as in the case of my Uncle who was in 1/9 QVTs and died in France, I appreciate the information given to me by people on this forum.

Kesannah

Kesannah,

You might be interested to know that although the Queen Victoria's Rifles (QVRs) were part of the London Regiment in The Great War (as 9th Battalion, London Regiment (Queen Victoria's Rifles)), the unit had strong historical links with the King's Royal Rifle Corps and The Rifle Brigade.

The QVRs were formed by the amalgamation of the 1st Middlesex Volunteer Rifle Corps and the 19th Middlesex Volunteer Rifle Corps. These earlier units had been affiliated as Volunteer battalions to the KRRC and The Rifle Brigade respectively.

After The Great War, the London Regiment was disbanded and the QVRs were re-affiliated to the KRRC, and during WW2, the two QVR battalions became the 7th and 8th battalions of the KRRC.

Just thought this might be useful background on the connections between the regiments of your two relatives.

CHeers,

Mark

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kesannah

Mark once again I apologise for not answering sooner.

Thankyou for this information.

I had no idea that there was any connection between the regiments.

I am learning something new every day.

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Guest Colin Buckley

Hello all,

I have been following this topic with interest as I would like to visit the theatres my grandfather was active in. I am aware of "The Long Long Trail", but he may have transferred between battalions, add to this I live in Norway so gathering this info may take some time, any help would be gratefully received.

I am aware he won the DCM at Le Cateau, with 4th Battalion on 17th October 1918, but am unsure if he spent the whole war with this battalion as it appears they did not spend all of the war in France. He was Sjt J Buckley 8772.

Many thanks,

Col Buckley

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