lionboxer Posted 24 September , 2008 Share Posted 24 September , 2008 I know this is not Great War but I think a non-comm is still a non-comm, and besides this is the only place I think I could get some help. In the Book of Remembrance for Norfolk villages in Norwich Cathedral there are two names under our village of Bergh Apton that are not on the village war memorial. One man has just been confirmed (by an amazing stroke of luck) as having links with the village. Apparently he lodged in the Manor during all the school holidays in the five years proceeding WW2. His father was the Governor of Bihar in India and the CWGC confirms this. Our second man (or woman) H.C. HALES is not registered on the CWGC at all. A C.H. HALES is registered but has NoK in Shropshire. We wondered if this man may have had the same links as our lodger but this has been discounted. There is a HC HALE whose NoK lived in Diss, Norfolk about twenty miles from here, but as yet we can find no links. Do you think either the Book of Remembrance or the CWGC could have mispellings of the names? Where do we go from here? Suggestions please. Lionboxer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
izzy Posted 24 September , 2008 Share Posted 24 September , 2008 why not try local archives for newspaper articles for his death, parish newsletters,baptism records in the local church even a mention on a family headstone in local churchyard. probate indexes[if there is a will]. Try the local press with an appeal for information or even try the phone book there may be family in locality hope this is of some use to you and good luck in your search. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyhound Posted 24 September , 2008 Share Posted 24 September , 2008 Could easily be a name variation or misspelling. Or he didn't meet the CWGC criteria. Merchant Navy for example. As for local connection, have you thought of schools? I had problems identifying a couple of the WWII names on our WM, but it turned out that they had both attended the village primary school, and I was able to get more details from the school register. Both families had left the village post-war so the NOK addresses were different on CWGC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
izzy Posted 24 September , 2008 Share Posted 24 September , 2008 greyhound ,im certain that merchant navy personel are covered by c.w.g.c what about the tower hill memorial ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyhound Posted 24 September , 2008 Share Posted 24 September , 2008 Only if they died as a result of enemy action AND while on duty. There's a lad on our WM who died in an accident, and he didn't qualify for CWGC commemoration. Very unfair IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Clark Posted 24 September , 2008 Share Posted 24 September , 2008 Lionboxer, Don't worry about the fact he's a WW2 casualty, T.D has already stated that WW2 non-coms can be dealt with on the GWF. It's entirely possible that the book may contain errors and mis-spellings. We have found many incidents where this has happened in Kent. A case in point being this one - http://www.kentfallen.com/PDF%20REPORTS/AS...AR%20SCHOOL.pdf and this one - http://www.kentfallen.com/PDF%20REPORTS/AS...CHOOL%20WW2.pdf You may indeed have found yourself a genuine non com! The only way of finding out for sure is to first try and get hold of his DEATH CERTIFICATE. This should provide the information you need to make an informed judgement. If you are stuck with any aspect then just post on this thread. If you have the time it may be worthwhile trawling through the local newspapers for details on his service or death. First of all search the GRO death indexes (someone may very kindly help you in this respect if you ask). If you don't have the time, funds or inclination to carry this case forward then hand it to someone else. It's vitally important we don't miss one single man! I wish you well. Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ppc1919 Posted 25 September , 2008 Share Posted 25 September , 2008 It could be that the parents of H C Hale lived in the village of Bergh Apton. CWGC states: Son of Samuel and Edith Elizabeth Hale; husband of Grace Mary Hale, of Diss Norfolk. His wife was most likely connected to Diss and his parents could have been local to your village. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionboxer Posted 13 October , 2008 Author Share Posted 13 October , 2008 Thanks for you help and suggestions. The next step will be a trawl through the papers and a search for the DC. I have another possible non-comm that I'll start a new topic with. Lionboxer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionboxer Posted 31 March , 2009 Author Share Posted 31 March , 2009 Glad to report the mystery of the Man Who Never Was has now been cleared up with the most extra-ordinary coincidence. After fruitless hours of searching all the recomendations made above, I, in desparation, contacted the MOD Records explaining the situation. Knowing they only release records to NoK I asked if they would just look through the record of Harry Charles HALE to see if there was any mention of my village of Bergh Apton. Trying to cut a long story short, the reply came that Harry's wife Grace gave her address when they married in 1938 as 56 Bussey Bridge, Bergh Apton.... right where I'm sitting now!!!! Of all the possible places or links with the village that it could have been, it happened to be my house and me, another spooky coincidence that I've had since starting all this research. There's more...once we'd cracked the code further revelations came thick and fast. Just prior to getting my teeth into Mr Hale I had been researching the family that lived here before me, the South's (see my latest posting in "Victor's Victory" on the GWF). Mrs South was the older married sister of Grace who she had come to live with. I remembered that a neighbor used to visit Mrs South when she'd moved away to Pulham Market before we came here. She gave me the old address and I went to have a look (Friday 13th believe it or not!). Mrs South and Grace had died several years ago but the lady opposite their bungalow still had the telephone number of their niece. That night a very excited and amazed lady telephoned explaining that it was her Uncle Charlie as he was known, that was killed at Monte Casino in 1944. There's more...that weekend Charlie's niece came to visit us, stepping into her aunt's house for the first time in over thirty years. She used to stay here on school holidays. An emotional afternoon was had with plenty of tales and lots of family photo's too. A beautiful coloured portrait of Charlie and Grace was the star piece, giving our mystery man a face at last. A photo of him in uniform is on the way. So now, in the sixty fifth year of his death Charlie Hale will have his due recognition when his name will be added to the village war memorial where it should be. Lionboxer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Tiger Posted 31 March , 2009 Share Posted 31 March , 2009 Fantastic story, thanks for posting. I'm pleased he will now be commemorated as he so rightly deserves. Well done Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisharley9 Posted 31 March , 2009 Share Posted 31 March , 2009 Nice one mate Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Bennitt Posted 1 April , 2009 Share Posted 1 April , 2009 Another great story out of Bergh Apton I will drop by and admire your war memorial next time I visit my sister in Haddiscoe. cheers Martin B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShirlD Posted 1 April , 2009 Share Posted 1 April , 2009 What a wonderful story! Another remembered with honour. Cheers Shirley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionboxer Posted 1 April , 2009 Author Share Posted 1 April , 2009 Thanks for your kind comment's. It's nice to share with people who appreciate these things. Actually, I still can't believe all these coincidences happened. Almost at a stroke three mysteries were cleared up, 1 the location of Victor Gillingwater's home, 2 the actual owner of the RMLI cap badge being Bertie South and 3 bringing Charlie Hale home at last. For want of a better way to put it, it seems to me that this has been my destiny to sort this all out. Can I really be the "Chosen One"?!! Lionboxer PS I will post a photo of Charlie in uniform to finish this thread. PPS Martin B. please contact me when you next come this way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionboxer Posted 1 April , 2009 Author Share Posted 1 April , 2009 Almost forgot. Thanks Mods for letting this WW2 story overspill into Great War territory! Lionboxer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest KevinEndon Posted 1 April , 2009 Share Posted 1 April , 2009 An excellent thread to read, thank you Lionboxer and mods for allowing us an insight into life and death in a little unknown place (until now) called Bergh Apton. Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionboxer Posted 18 April , 2009 Author Share Posted 18 April , 2009 Just received Charlie's service record from the MoD today. Looking through found his enlistment date as 18th April 1940. What's todays' date? 18th April. Hmmm!! Lionboxer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shred Posted 18 April , 2009 Share Posted 18 April , 2009 Lionboxer, Amazing coincidences? Or maybe not. Great work. Garry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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