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Remembered Today:

Unique '07' Hooky!


findabetterole
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Hello Chums,

Here, from our favourite auction site... no prizes for the winning guess!!!... is a most unique '07' hooky. Please study and make your own oppinnions... 250283394591. It took me three seconds to authenticate my findings (I think all the ricasso stampings must have run in the wash!!!). Comments on this are most welcome.. :D

Seph

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For the benefit of those of us who know very little about bayonets*, could you elaborate a bit on this one?

* they are long, sharp and hang on the end of things that go bang.

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It looks a bit odd to me, but I'm not a bayonet collector. The absence of the usual marks etc. If the woodwork was taken off would that confirm the quillion was a reweld??

Gunner Bailey

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Would it be something to do with the quillion disappearing before WW1 and the clearance hole not appearing until 1916/1917; that's apart from the ricasso marking disappearing on this particular example?

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The quillion was omitted in 1912/13, and was removed on bayonets after that, clearence hole 1916/17, Therefore it shouldn't have both.

The seller states that the ricasso markings were removed by some aggressive wire wooling.

Gaz

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Guest KevinEndon
The seller states that the ricasso markings were removed by some aggressive wire wooling.

Gaz

must have arms like Garth or a lot of patience to remove the marks with just wire wool. I wonder what they are trying to hide if anything

Kevin

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must have arms like Garth or a lot of patience to remove the marks with just wire wool. I wonder what they are trying to hide if anything

Kevin

They are trying to hide the fact that it's a hooky hooky,Kev.

Garron's right but just look at the quill,looks a bit bent forward & is too long.Was it august '13 when the regs changed? Any with an armoury stamp after that date would be fake(except for some Aussie ones??But we dont touch them any more ;) )

Agree on the overenthusiastic wire wooling!

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The seller has an excellent rating. Before we jump to conclusions I think we should give him the benefit of the doubt. He sells a lot of military stuff, of all types. I think the bayonet might well have come into his possession like that, and he's just selling it on, going on limited knowledge.

As an eBayer myself, and with a very high rating I'm very proud of, I know what I'd do if someone pointed this out to me. I'd either cancel the listing completely, or at least add a bit to the description pointing out the anomalies. Anyone want to inform him and see what he does?

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A slight detour which I hope will be forgiven.

I have a bayonet made by Enfield (EFD) dated 5 '14 but it has a clearance hole. From what I read above, it seems that this bayonet doesn't fit in with known production info. Any quick comments about this one?

Tom

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A slight detour which I hope will be forgiven.

I have a bayonet made by Enfield (EFD) dated 5 '14 but it has a clearance hole. From what I read above, it seems that this bayonet doesn't fit in with known production info. Any quick comments about this one?

Tom

Clearance holes were added retrospectively when bayonets were refinished or reissued. So it is no problem to have an early dated bayonet with a clearance hole.

This is part of the issue here - if the hole was added later, the quillon would have been removed at the same time.

Chris

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I have some doubts.

1. The absence of dates

2. The end of the quillon does not look quite right to me - a little too round.

3. In the photo with the bayonet held upright and the quillon to the right, to my eyes there seems to be a slightly darker section of blue/black, which could be a trace of a weld.

Just MHO.

Richie

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Willywombat.... I've already politely informed him (now two days ago), and have been totally ignored!

Chris.... your correct about the clearance hole. This issue here is not simply a matter of the clearance hole, for yes.. its very normal to have quillion removed and pre 1916 dated '07's with a clearance hole, but:

1) The clearance hole is on a supposed and extremely questionable hooked quillion.

2) All of the ricasso stampings have been ground off. That alone is very suspicious, and pinpoints the item as bveing something it is not. The not in this case is being the genuine hooked quillion.

'Richie B'' has come up witth a very valid observation in reference to the weld compound... blue/black.

Lets look ast the fault in a logical order.

1) An '07' hooked quillion with a clearance hole = three years after the amendment to remove the hook from the quillion. Even if this was a genuine item, no self respecting armourer would let this item pass a service schedule without removing the hook. It also would have been noticed at the packing stage.

2) No stampings on either ricasso except for a partial manufacturers name. All of the manufacturers are renowned for partial stampings, Sanderson and Wilkinson especially. However, why has everything been so carefully hidden except the the word Sanderson? This manufacturer normally stamps the acceptance/manufacture date just above and to either side of the name. So, in order to hide the real manufacture date... grind of the numerals.... yeah, brilliant idea.... NOT!. Such a bad job has been made of that though, the fool, in the attempt to hide the remake, has taken everything off!.. inspectors stamps, bend-test-mark, crows foot... everything! Now, instead of thinking that its probably just a lazy worker at the Sanderson factory.... this item has been highlighted... underlined, placed in italics... and written in bold!

I purposely did not make comment about the seller, but the story line of an over zealous 'wire wooling'...... aww come on.. my two years old neace could have thought up a better one!

As for the asking price... the seller has been watching to many episodes of Star-Trek!

Seph

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The above mentioned item has been removed from e***, error in the listing.

I should say so but at least the seller has listened to the comments made about it.

Andy A

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The above mentioned item has been removed from e***, error in the listing.

I should say so but at least the seller has listened to the comments made about it.

Andy A

The seller has just replied to my email, and he mentions that he bought several '07's as a job lot... the offending one was included. He does also have a couple of true hooky's that hes putting up for sale shortly, so i'll be interested in those when they come up.

An honest seller... and I think he should bve commended for withdrawing the offending item! I wonder if he knows about this site? ;)

Seph

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