wyliecoyote Posted 18 August , 2008 Share Posted 18 August , 2008 I am not really up on the subject, but I am always interested in learning new things about the Imperial German Army. I collect old photos and I have several of German field guns. I am not sure which ones belonged to Foot Artillery and which ones belonged to Field Artillery units. Hopefully there are some knowledgable members who can illuminate the subject. How I will start this thread is by adding photos, hopefully of the same type artillery piece, and if there are those of you who wish, add photos of the same type, then we move along to another type. First photo is labled with a Prussian seal: 2 Battr. 9 cm Ers. Btl. 44 (2nd Batterie 9 cm Ersatz Battalion 44). I am not sure if this was a training unit or a large replacement organization. A similar looking gun identified as Lothringen 1915. All shoulderboards are "10". 10th Artillerie zu Fuss? The Niedersächsiches Fußartillerie-Regt. Nr.10 was stationed in Straßburg in Alsace, belonging to XV Armee Korps. This third photo is identified as Graudenz 1918. Graudenz was a Fortress in West Prussia, not sure what unit this could be part of. I am not sure if it is the same type or not, you can see the cammoflage pattern that was used late in the war. What was the major difference between Foot Artillery & Field Artillery? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Clifton Posted 18 August , 2008 Share Posted 18 August , 2008 In simple terms, the Feldartillerie manned the 77mm field gun and the 105mm field howitzer, the equivalents on the British 18-pounder and 4.5-inch howitzer. The Fussartillerie manned all guns of larger calibres, equivalent to those manned in the British Army by the Royal Garrison Artillery. These guns were essentially Corps or Army troops, or fortress pieces, intended to reinforce an attack with heavier and less mobile weapons. Field Artillery was allocated to Divisions, normally on a permanent or semi-permanent basis. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Hederer Posted 19 August , 2008 Share Posted 19 August , 2008 George, You're question is pretty broad, and it could take a book to answer it properly. Is there something in particular you'd like to know? What Ron posted is correct though, I would hesitate to tie the allocation of guns based on size (and they say size doesn't matter!). As your picture shows, the Fussartillerie manned guns of smaller calibers as well, such as the 9 cmK. The Fussartillerie also manned captured guns, such as Russian light field howitzers. The Fussartillerie was an amazing complex arm in terms of organization and units. It'll make your head spin with the frequent changes of designation of individual batteries, and re-arms. Some of the regiments (and most battalions and almost all batteries) have no history as well, making is more difficult to follow their development. Verlag militaria is supposed to be publishing Fussartillerie volumes in their "Handbuch der Verbände und Truppen des deutschen Heeres 1914-1918," series, and this is something I am looking forward to very much. Trying to track individual Fussartillerie units is impossible now without resorting to the archives, and even then you might be dissapointed! Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete1052 Posted 19 August , 2008 Share Posted 19 August , 2008 What was the major difference between Foot Artillery & Field Artillery? Click here for a general discussion of the differences between foot and field artillery. Note that this explanation is a generic one for the armies of the Western world; there were most likely differences and nuances in how the terms applied to the artillery of the armies of specific nations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prussian Posted 19 August , 2008 Share Posted 19 August , 2008 Hi! Another tip for identifying are the uniforms. Both had the ball upon the helmet, but the difference between field and foot artillerie is: Field artillerie had swedish cuffs (2 buttons horizontal) and foot artillerie had brandenburg cuffs (3 buttons vertical) Unfortunately, the cuffs disappeared with the tunic m15 Cheers from Germany, Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyliecoyote Posted 19 August , 2008 Author Share Posted 19 August , 2008 Ron, Paul, Pete & Andy Gentlemen, thank you for your responses, glad to be able to generate some interest & participation. So these first three photos are A.F. troops, the first two you can see the Brandenburg cuffs, and the third I can presume they are A.F. as they are in a fortress? Does anybody know what A.F. Regiment was in Graudenz? Can anyone say for sure whether or not all three guns are 9 cm's? Here are three more: This one we have seen before, it was labeled 21 cm (M1910)Mörser, Montignay. We see men working on a 21 cm howitzer? They were designated as morser to disguise their true purpose in peacetime, is that correct? What model is this gun? Also Paul id'ed the M1893 15cm s.F.H. heavy howitzers at right. What caliber were they? This one was labeled "Franz, Flandern, 1918. This one appears to be a cammo'ed 21 cm Mörser M 16 or M17,(known as a Lange Mörser). These troops should be A.F. troops by what has been discussed. This next one was labeled minenwerfer. I am not sure but I believe it is a 25cm s.M.W. heavy minenwerfer, I do believe that Pionier troops actually fired these, is that correct? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Hederer Posted 19 August , 2008 Share Posted 19 August , 2008 Let's see if I can answer some of your questions: 1) Yes, it's a 21 cm Mörser. It's a model M10, but it's always referred to simply as a Mörser. The older M99 was known as a 21 cm Mörser. Complicated? Not really, but it's very easy to get confused in German texts if you don't make careful note of the types. 2) the M93 is 15 cm. It was always noted simply as a s.F.H. 3) Franz is a 21 cm Mörser M 16 or maybe a M17, I can't tell, known as a Lange Mörser. 4) The last looks like a schwere Minenwerfer. Yes, it was used by Pioniere. Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Sheldon Posted 19 August , 2008 Share Posted 19 August , 2008 By the way and at the risk of being regarded as pedantic, this thread offers another opportunity to me to remind everyone that there never was an Imperial German Army. I know that the title crops up repeatedly in the Anglophone literature, but that does not make it right. Imperial German Navy - correct; Imperial German Army - wrong. It was made up of several different contingents. I enjoyed the photos of the various guns, incidentally. Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyliecoyote Posted 19 August , 2008 Author Share Posted 19 August , 2008 Paul, I added your additions/corrections in red, thank you for sharing your knowledge! I can see now that the barrel of the M16/17 morser is longer than the M10. Jack, glad you are enjoying the photos. Right you are about that. What would the more proper term be for the combined Armies of the Imperial German States be? I appologize for the quality of the scans, it appears that my scanner may be soiling the bed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyliecoyote Posted 19 August , 2008 Author Share Posted 19 August , 2008 Not a German Morser, but a Škoda 30.5 cm Mörser M. 11 morser. If you look closely there are Germans helping set up, there are several kratzen and at least 1 pickelhaube I can see. Caption reads "Setting up an Austrian 30.5 cm Morser". What a monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyliecoyote Posted 19 August , 2008 Author Share Posted 19 August , 2008 Side view of these huge morsers, caption reads, "Our allied brothers loading a heavy gun". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyliecoyote Posted 19 August , 2008 Author Share Posted 19 August , 2008 Just nosing around I came across this thread which I missed in March. Paul, I promise this thread won't give you a headache! That thread can be found here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoplophile Posted 19 August , 2008 Share Posted 19 August , 2008 The German custom of calling their 210mm short-barreled artillery piece a Mörser ('mortar') was a relic of the late nineteenth century, when the term lange Mörser ('long mortar') was used to designate artillery pieces with barrels that were about twelve calibres long. In other words, the 1910 model Mörser was a Mörser because its daddy (the 1899 model) was a Mörser, and the 1899 model Mörser was a Mörser because its immediate predecessor (the date of introduction of which slips my mind) was a Mörser. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyliecoyote Posted 20 August , 2008 Author Share Posted 20 August , 2008 Thanks for the info Hoplophile! Several years ago I picked up a series of photos, of which the previous two and the following were part of, non of them were very clear, always wondered if that was on purpose or not: Captioned, "Garde-foot artillery in combat" (Garde-fussartillerie im gefecht). No sign of the guns, men standing around limbers are covering their ears. I suppose the limbers & caissons would be kept to the rear of the guns in case of an enemy shot hitting them and preventing destruction of the gun. I suspect these were all Ostfront, as one photo was of a mg shooting at was captioned as a Russian flyer. Next one we can see the kugelhaube covers have regimentals but are unreadable. Caption, " Engaged artillery in a occupied city" (Einrrücken von Artillerie in eine besetzte Stadt). This next one is captioned, "Artillery on the move" (Verrückende Artillerie). Strangely there are no artillery pieces attached to the caissons(?). Are those rears carts caissons? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyliecoyote Posted 20 August , 2008 Author Share Posted 20 August , 2008 Last one is captioned, "Artillerie drives into position." (Artillerie fährt in stellung). Gun looks like the type that was in the Graudenz photo. Anyone? The men moving off with the limber(?), you can see two men ride single file on the two horses on the left, looks like a six horse team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Sheldon Posted 20 August , 2008 Share Posted 20 August , 2008 German post-war writing about the German army of 1914 - 1918 tends to employ one of two similar expressions when the entire army is under discussion: viz 'Die alte Armee' [The old army] or 'Das alte deutsche Heer' [The old German army]. My preference is just to use 'The German army'. Some of the old contingents were very independent-minded - especially the Bavarians, who refused to fall in with the overall numbering system. To this day there still exists the Bavarian Army Museum in Ingolstadt. Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 20 August , 2008 Share Posted 20 August , 2008 Landwehr Artillerie - 1911 Cnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 20 August , 2008 Share Posted 20 August , 2008 1916 - Fusartillerie Batterie nr. 490 with 15 cm Ringkanone. Cnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyliecoyote Posted 20 August , 2008 Author Share Posted 20 August , 2008 Jack I prefer Die Alte Armee! Eddy As ever, 2 great photos! The Landwehr photo, is that a 75mm gun? Ring Kannone, I was attempting to look that up, from some photo's that seems to be then a fortress weapon, looks similar to the Belgian gun in the Antwerp photo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 21 August , 2008 Share Posted 21 August , 2008 George, I think it is a 77 mm gun The Ring kanone is same type as Belgian gun in Antwerp, no recoil system, high on wheels intended to fire fom behind a parapet. Regards, Cnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 21 August , 2008 Share Posted 21 August , 2008 Field Artillerie Regiment nr. 31 (1ste Unterelsässischen) in 1913 (Hagenau) Cnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 21 August , 2008 Share Posted 21 August , 2008 21 cm Mörser in full recoil Cnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 21 August , 2008 Share Posted 21 August , 2008 Field artillery 1915 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Hederer Posted 24 August , 2008 Share Posted 24 August , 2008 Side view of these huge morsers, caption reads, "Our allied brothers loading a heavy gun". Hello George, Sorry missed you post--we're on holidays off the coast of Denmark at the moment. I think that thread gave a lot of people headaches at the time! Have all your questions been answered? I don't think we can spend enough time talking about the heavies--they played such a critical role during the war for all the armies. Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 24 August , 2008 Share Posted 24 August , 2008 42 cm Mörser Cnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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