NeilEvans Posted 8 July , 2008 Share Posted 8 July , 2008 Hi I've been having trouble find this chap. Me thinks i've overlooked him totally, and that the answer is obvious. But can somebody please help me find him. Photograph taken Whitchurch Shrops. Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_hughes Posted 8 July , 2008 Share Posted 8 July , 2008 Hiya, tried various permutations and combinations of JONES for covering dates 17-20 Sept 1917 on Geoff's search engine, including the Canadian/Australian options, but none seemed to fit. I went several days further than the 17th because your shot of the headstone seems to suggest 19th Sept is the date? It's not unknown for a wrong date to be given by the family, nor for the man himself to have served under a different name! Do we assume he is not on the Whitchurch War Memorial (or any other in Shropshire)? LST_164 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilEvans Posted 8 July , 2008 Author Share Posted 8 July , 2008 Hi LST Sorry typo on my part it is the 19th. I'm full of them today. There is an outstanding T Jones on Whitchurch memorial. I presume its the same chap. I'm rather happy that it's not just me who cant find him. Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Morgan Posted 8 July , 2008 Share Posted 8 July , 2008 By a strange coincidence, there is a soldier listed in CWGC as 90279 Pte. Thomas Bagley Stockton, Machine Gun Corps. The date of death fits and CWGC says he was the Son of Benjamin and Alice Stockton, of 14, Claypit Terrace, Whitchurch, Salop. So the date is right, Whitchurch is right, and the forenames of the parents are right. But the surname Stockton is the fly in the ointment. Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilEvans Posted 8 July , 2008 Author Share Posted 8 July , 2008 Tom, you may be onto something. The S maybe Stockton? Just looked at the Whitchurch memorial listing, and surprise, no Thomas Bagley Stockton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilEvans Posted 8 July , 2008 Author Share Posted 8 July , 2008 only the 1891 cenus shows Thomas Bagley Stockton. Alice nee Murhall and Benjamin Stockton married 1879 Where does the Jones come into it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Inspector Posted 8 July , 2008 Share Posted 8 July , 2008 Hi I've been having trouble find this chap. Me thinks i've overlooked him totally, and that the answer is obvious. But can somebody please help me find him. Photograph taken Whitchurch Shrops. Neil Hi Neil Can find Thomas S Jones b 1889 Wirksworth Derbyshire with his father Benjamin S Jones b 1852 Wolverhampton on Ancestry but wife is not Alice. Both 1891 and 1901 censuses. Regards, Barry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Morgan Posted 8 July , 2008 Share Posted 8 July , 2008 re. my earlier post about Pte. Stockton. I've just noticed anothere similarity. The age given on CWGC for Pte. Stockton also matches the age given on the gravestone for Pte. Jones - 29. Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveE Posted 8 July , 2008 Share Posted 8 July , 2008 only the 1891 cenus shows Thomas Bagley Stockton. Alice nee Murhall and Benjamin Stockton married 1879 Where does the Jones come into it I don't know where Jones comes into it either but out of interest I had a look for the death registration of Alice. Nothing recorded under Jones for 1931 (September or December Quarters) but there is an entry for Alice Stockton in Whitchurch, September Quarter 1931, aged 67, all of which again fits with (most of) the headstone details. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_hughes Posted 8 July , 2008 Share Posted 8 July , 2008 How weird! SDGW shows 90279 Pte Thomas STOCKTON born and enlisted Whitchurch Salop., KIA F&F 19.9.17 Formerly T4/056193 ASC He could still have assumed a different surname - I know of examples where aliases were not picked up by CWGC or SDGW. If his parents according to CWGC have the same forenames as on the stone, he comes from the same town, and died the same day then there are a few too many coincidences in this picture. But you're right - why the different parental surnames on the stone & the CWGC Register? Did they change THEIR names??! Suggestion - if the cemetery records are held by the Council or Church, have a look at the burial registers under the date of death of at least the first parent, to see if address matches that on the CWGC site. LST_164 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilEvans Posted 9 July , 2008 Author Share Posted 9 July , 2008 This is exciting. Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilEvans Posted 9 July , 2008 Author Share Posted 9 July , 2008 CWGC Info Name: STOCKTON, THOMAS BAGLEY Initials: T B Nationality: United Kingdom Rank: Private Regiment/Service: Machine Gun Corps (Infantry) Unit Text: 27th Coy. Age: 29 Date of Death: 19/09/1917 Service No: 90279 Additional information: Son of Benjamin and Alice Stockton, of 14, Claypit Terrace, Whitchurch, Salop. Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead Grave/Memorial Reference: II. K. 15. Cemetery: DIVISIONAL COLLECTING POST CEMETERY AND EXTENSION Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_hughes Posted 9 July , 2008 Share Posted 9 July , 2008 Doesn't this just raise all sorts of queries regarding "identity"? Could the parents have gone along with an enlistment deception to the extent of signing themselves under the Stockton surname? Don't forget, it was the families and not the authorities who supplied personal information such as names, addresses, age etc on the CWGC enquiry form after the War. But the CWGC would have used the contact details supplied to them by the War Office based on the soldier's service papers... or maybe the parents had their own reasons for wanting to be called Jones/Stockton...Stockton is a well-known surname just over the Border west of Whitchurch, but that's just by the way. How about another official source for you to examine when you're next at the Shropshire County Record Office - the Electoral Registers for the period around the First World War? Obviously these are arranged by place, then ward/street etc but you have an address to guide you. Who is/are the registered voters at 14 Claypit Terrace as far as the local Council is concerned? LST_164 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilEvans Posted 9 July , 2008 Author Share Posted 9 July , 2008 All very good points. I fear we may never no the truth. Jones is obviously one of the most common names in Britain, i guess many such alias' used Jones. But why oh why use Jones on the headstone. The 1891 Census shows the family as Stocktons. I don't understand why Jones would be used on the headstone though. I still think the initial S holds the key. When i have the time, i'll try to dig deeper. Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
izzy Posted 9 July , 2008 Share Posted 9 July , 2008 would the cemetery registers of the graveyard give the address of the deceased also why not try local newspapers for obituarys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilEvans Posted 9 July , 2008 Author Share Posted 9 July , 2008 I'll try to check Izzy. Problem is it may take a while. Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Inspector Posted 11 July , 2008 Share Posted 11 July , 2008 Hi Neil Can find Thomas S Jones b 1889 Wirksworth Derbyshire with his father Benjamin S Jones b 1852 Wolverhampton on Ancestry but wife is not Alice. Both 1891 and 1901 censuses. Regards, Barry Hi Neil Further to above, the 'S' stands for Shakeshaft, Benjamin died 1908. His wife was Sarah Eleanor Bradley m 1875., happy hunting. Regards, Barry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitchurch Museum Posted 16 May , 2015 Share Posted 16 May , 2015 Hi, You may have resolved this, but you might find this interesting. We're carrying out research on The Great War in Whitchurch, Shropshire http://thegreatwar.whitchurch-shropshire.co.uk and Terry Evanson, one of the projects researchers, came up with the following: Thomas Bagley Jones served as Stockton Private No 90279 27th Company, Machine Gun Corps (Infantry) Formally Army Service Corps T/4/056139 Born in Whitchurch in 1888, the eldest son of Benjamin Stockton and Alice Jones of 14, Claypit Street, Whitchurch Thomas was a General Labourer before joining the Army Killed in Action, Belgium 19th September 1917 Age 29 Buried, Divisional Collecting Post Cemetery, Ypres, West-Vlaanderen, Belgium Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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