johnnie Posted 4 July , 2008 Share Posted 4 July , 2008 I was wondering if anybody could provide me with advice for searching the Times online for casualty details. I have but in a few names and end up with lots or hits in different sections. For example I have been researching 2nd Lt Percy Geralnd Lambert who was killed with the 25th Bn Northumberland Fusiliers on the 21st March 1918, although he had previously served with the City of London Yeomanry (see a previous thread on the forum). A search for Lambert brings up 928 hits in the following areas: Articles by category Advertising 143 articles Business 85 articles Editorial & Commantry 343 articles Features 66 articles News 225 articles People 66 articles If the man had been mentioned in the times, say for a wound, a commission, or because he was killed which of the areas above would be best to check. I have noticed death and wound notices in the Times before, but do not know what catagory they were in. Any advice on this subject would be great. Jonathan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhclark Posted 4 July , 2008 Share Posted 4 July , 2008 Jonathan. Considering officers first, casualties were reported throughout the war. For other ranks, there was a cut-off after which the lists became so large that the names were no longer published. It's rather a long time since I did my searches, but I recollect that it was sometime in either 1917 or 1918. A bit vague I'm afraid. Can someone else pinpoint the cut-off date more accurately? What I did for those who died was to look at each issue page by page, rather than use the search engine, after the date of death as reported on CWGC. The lists are headed "Roll of Honour", and after a while your eye will rapidly pick up this headline. The list can occur anywhere in the issue. You can then look at the list name by name. You will find that The Times would report the death usually within three wekks or so of it occurring, perhaps rather sooner for officers. As you have found, the more common the name the greater the number of hits. Fortunately I am researching a very uncommon name, so the search engine did produce hits for wounded men. The above search method, issue by issue, is laborious, but since there is no charge for searching the only cost is your time. It worked for me. I'll be interested to see what methods others recommend. Noel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Lees Posted 4 July , 2008 Share Posted 4 July , 2008 Jonathon, It is the 'People' section that the casualty lists appear in. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beaverpass Posted 4 July , 2008 Share Posted 4 July , 2008 Jonathan, On the Times search page immediately below the keyword entry block there are two radio buttons, labelled search for words in title, citation abstract and the other one labelled in entire article content. Ensure that you have selected the latter, otherwise you are searching in the article title or "headline" only. I too get 928 hits on searching keyword lambert with the "title" button selected. By selecting the second button I get 47,411 (yes 47,411) hits! Now, that's not much help is it? However, you are searching the entire database 1785-1985 if you do not specify a date-range. Go to the box labelled Limit the current search and enter a year, range of years or a year-month range in the format 1918 or 1916-1918 or 1918 march-june. Finally, in addition to searching your man I searched for twenty other members of the Northumberland Fusiliers who died on that same date, many of them with distinctive or unusual names and I did not get any hits. So, the comment above regarding the discontinuing of casualty lists appears to be correct. EDIT: I went back to the Times and discovered that the last casualty list that included Other Ranks was published 31 October 1917. All casualty lists (Roll of Honour) after that date contain the names of officers only. Cheers, Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stebie9173 Posted 4 July , 2008 Share Posted 4 July , 2008 The cut-off for the wounding of men was early May 1917 (relating to early April 1917 - I believe the casualties in the battle of Arras were some of the first not published in the newspapers). Battalions for infantry were shown until circa March 1916. Officers casualties (wounded/missing/killed) continued for the war. Copies of the Official Casualty Lists from mid 1917 through to the end of the war can be viewed and printed on microfilm at the British Library Neewspaper section at Colindale (browsing only - no search, of course). The search is very hit and miss because of the small type. It took me ages to find my great-uncles' DOW by browsing - the search never got close to finding him. Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kildaremark Posted 4 July , 2008 Share Posted 4 July , 2008 I agree with the sentiments about hit and miss:- I searched for my grandfather and the search engine did not pick him up under any of the details published i.e. his name, number or address: McLoughlin, 64278 Cpl James (kilcorney, Enfield) When I type in: "84278" - it works everytime even though the number is clearly "64278"! So it is worth looking at the details and seeing what they could be mistaken for. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnie Posted 4 July , 2008 Author Share Posted 4 July , 2008 Thanks for the advice on this. Out of interest, what happens if a man is missing. In the case of Lambert, he is missing rather than killed so would he have been listed in the casualty section in the weeks after the 21st March, or would it have to wait a few month until he went from missing to presumed dead? Jonathan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stebie9173 Posted 4 July , 2008 Share Posted 4 July , 2008 He would be listed as Missing some 4 to 6 weeks after 21-3-1918. He should be listed in the Official Casualty Lists at Colindale, and probably in his local press. Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveE Posted 4 July , 2008 Share Posted 4 July , 2008 Copies of the Official Casualty Lists from mid 1917 through to the end of the war can be viewed and printed on microfilm at the British Library Neewspaper section at Colindale (browsing only - no search, of course). I would like to have a look at these sometime, any clues as to how they're organised? By date, regiment etc.... Any details would be appreciated. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stebie9173 Posted 4 July , 2008 Share Posted 4 July , 2008 The records are on two microfilms one covering 1917 into early 1918 (I think) and the other 1918-1919. The layout is very similar to the Times, but with a weeks reports compiled together sub-divided by days, and further by "sections", which I haven't figured out yet but presumably from differing bases/theatres. e.g. Week ended 11-6-1918, Daily list of 9-6-1918, Section VII, etc. The Regimental layout is by Army precedence, exactly the same as the Times. Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveE Posted 4 July , 2008 Share Posted 4 July , 2008 Cheers for that Steve, I'm assuming you've accessed them a few times, have you ever seen the East African theatre mentioned? Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_hughes Posted 5 July , 2008 Share Posted 5 July , 2008 SteveE, a couple of volumes of the Official Casualty Lists also in the Department of Printed Books at the IWM Lambeth. Don't know if they're the same as the Colindale ones offhand, as it's many years since I used them. LST_164 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveE Posted 5 July , 2008 Share Posted 5 July , 2008 Thanks LST_164 that's worth knowing, may be able to check them out if and when I find the time to look at other 'stuff' I need to at IWM. Regards Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stebie9173 Posted 5 July , 2008 Share Posted 5 July , 2008 The Theatres of war are not mentioned specifically by that date, but the "Sections" may hold some significance. Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveE Posted 5 July , 2008 Share Posted 5 July , 2008 Thanks Steve, looks like I'm going to have to find some time to get to Colindale (or IWM) to check them out. Regards Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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