Chris_Baker Posted 23 June , 2008 Share Posted 23 June , 2008 Two soldiers: 1. Reginald Francis John Hollowell. KIA with 87th Brigade RFA on 21 December 1917. Originally served with 1st Seaforth Highlanders under the name Reginald Cameron, deserted in March 1916. Re-enlisted as Reginald Campion, served as Serjeant 119729 with the RFA. Medal index cards exist. No service record. CWGC entry agrees with above but adds he was awarded the DCM. I don't think so. No entry in "Soldiers Died". This man was from Northampton. 2. James Campion. Appears in "Soldiers Died" as Serjeant 119729 with the RFA. Born in Manchester, enlisted in Cork. Killed in action on 23 December 1917. Has a medal index card. No service record. Does not appear in CWGC registers. Two different men - or a (quite understandable apart from the name and places) admin mix up? The same surname, number, regiment and almost date of death seem remarkable coincidences if they are two men. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 23 June , 2008 Author Share Posted 23 June , 2008 I should add that Reginald certainly existed and his 1891 and 1901 census information all agrees with NOK info given by CWGC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevew Posted 23 June , 2008 Share Posted 23 June , 2008 Not an expert, but I thought I'd reply What about death certificates? From what you have said I would've said he was the same man, but I'd like to see more proof before I put any money on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian turner Posted 23 June , 2008 Share Posted 23 June , 2008 Chris Reginald Hollowell indeed easy to find his birth: Surname First name(s) District Vol Page -------------------------------------------------------------- Births Mar 1888 -------------------------------------------------------------- HOLLOWELL Reginald Francis J Newport P 3a 745 Cannot readily find a James Campion born 'Manchester'. Plenty in the right time-frame born in the county of Lancashire but, without more knowledge, which was your man? Guess with the lack of info this might be a job for Terry D to peer into the CWGC files? Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 23 June , 2008 Author Share Posted 23 June , 2008 Reginald is the chap I am interested in. Thanks for his birth cert reference. I only came across James Campion when trying to find a CWGC reference for Reginald. I reckon this is all an admin mix up and James Campion did not exist - but it's not clear by any means. For me, this begs lots of questions. If Campion did not actually exist, how come there is a medal record? What process actually created these medals records? How would regimental records, used for SWDG, mix up a Reginald Campion with, perhaps, someone else's details? Or am I looking at a transcription error of SDGW and/or CWGC registers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian turner Posted 23 June , 2008 Share Posted 23 June , 2008 There appears much scope for error with two Campion surnames KIA within a couple of days of each other and both in the RFA. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kate Wills Posted 23 June , 2008 Share Posted 23 June , 2008 The only info I can offer on Hollowell straight away is that his address was 12 St Michael's Avenue, so presumably he is listed on the memorial in St Michael's Church. He is listed on the Northampton Town memorial as RFJ Hollowell. The only Campion listed there is GE of 7th Northamptonshires I have a look at the Independent magazine later Chris. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelPack Posted 23 June , 2008 Share Posted 23 June , 2008 Chris I have had a look at the MICs and I think that the error originated in the Hollowell MIC. The dark blue ink is a later entry on the card and it looks as if the clerk assumed that the alias of Reginald Campion (perhaps in reliance on information supplied by the parent) was used instead of James Campion. I assume that the RFA Medal Roll was checked for a Reginald Campion and when none was found a BWM and VM was issued in conjunction with the restored Star. In the meantime, the Medal Roll entry for James Campion (completely different reference) subsisted. I think that the CWGC entry is right in that entry for the alias is confined simply to Campion with no identification of the first name. As to the entry for a DCM and the SDGW entry ...well that's anyone's guess. Regards Mel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
staffsreg Posted 23 June , 2008 Share Posted 23 June , 2008 This forum never fails to amaze me.. with the willingness and sheer knowledge and fortitude of it's members. Long may it reign! Ivan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelPack Posted 23 June , 2008 Share Posted 23 June , 2008 Chris I have also noticed that the clerk cross referenced the third MIC for 'Reginald Cameron' for the 1914 Star with the same RFA Medal Roll references and this probably reinforced his assumption that the second alias was also a Reginald (Campion). regards Mel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivor Lee Posted 23 June , 2008 Share Posted 23 June , 2008 Chris Probably off track but could DCM be District Court Martial? Came across a man a few years ago whose relatives said he had the DCM. When I found his record it was a District Court Martial! Ivor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caroline@linkagecomputing.co.uk Posted 23 June , 2008 Share Posted 23 June , 2008 I am not an expert so should not be replying! there is always a BUT interesting fact? Reginald F Hallowell residing 1901 Census with parents Thomas and Harriet at 12 St Michaels Avenue was 2 doors away from Samuel S Campion Head Journalist and Kate wife and daughter Muriel age 15 residing at 16 St Michaels Avenue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 23 June , 2008 Author Share Posted 23 June , 2008 Thanks, Caroline. I had spotted that. I wonder if there was a Cameron family (his first false name) also nearby? Like the DCM thing. Could well be. Great thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Denham Posted 23 June , 2008 Share Posted 23 June , 2008 Chris The original 1924 CWGC register for the cemetery does not note a DCM for Hollowell. It could have been added later or be an error. I'll check for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Clifton Posted 23 June , 2008 Share Posted 23 June , 2008 Chris A few thoughts: As suggested by others, DCM is probably for a District Court Martial following his desertion in 1916. Reginald Hollowell becomes Reginald Cameron then becomes James Campion. Transcription or clerical error puts Reginald instead of James onto his papers. Cock-up preferred to conspiracy but the same RFA number very strongly suggests the same man. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caroline@linkagecomputing.co.uk Posted 23 June , 2008 Share Posted 23 June , 2008 Chris More info: Reginald F.J. Hallowell is on manifest travelling Liverpool to Boston Mass. USA on Mayflower 19 April 1903 for onward transit Canada final destination Brandon. name given as above, occupation- Clerk, orgin England Northampton age 15 years 4 months this seems to fit your man Hollowell. Is it possible that records could be under Canada? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 23 June , 2008 Author Share Posted 23 June , 2008 Thank you, Caroline. That is brilliant stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grantowi Posted 23 June , 2008 Share Posted 23 June , 2008 Chris, from CWGC: Name: CAMPION Initials: J Nationality: United Kingdom Rank: Serjeant Regiment/Service: ALIAS Date of Death: 21/12/1917 Service No: 119729 Additional information: See "HOLLOWELL" the true family name. Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead Cemetery: LA CLYTTE MILITARY CEMETERY Grant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 23 June , 2008 Author Share Posted 23 June , 2008 Thanks, Grant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Denham Posted 24 June , 2008 Share Posted 24 June , 2008 Chris CWGC has confirmed that the DCM is an error. They will remove it in due course but they have a software issue with amending the 'Awards' field at the moment. It will disappear at some stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 24 June , 2008 Author Share Posted 24 June , 2008 Thank you, Terry. I wonder how it got there in the first place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daggers Posted 24 June , 2008 Share Posted 24 June , 2008 Fantastic detection work all round. Morse, Wimsey, Holmes [both of them], Taggart et al will be green with envy. Daggers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Denham Posted 24 June , 2008 Share Posted 24 June , 2008 Chris Who knows! Possibly a DCM entry that should have been tagged onto another casualty at some time over the years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kate Wills Posted 22 July , 2008 Share Posted 22 July , 2008 No suitable candidates in the Northants / Beds volume of the National Roll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kate Wills Posted 25 July , 2008 Share Posted 25 July , 2008 I have looked in the N. Independent (owned by the Hollowell family) from New Year 1918 to end June 18. Nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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