Devils Own Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 Any ideas why rum was served up to the British and Irish troops on a daily basis rather than the national drink of the islands, uisce beatha? Additionally, were they given rum to raise moral, to lessen potential pain or to limited the natural instinct to save one's own skin? Furthermore, what was the strength of the rum? Was it diluted? So many (drink related) questions, so little time. Cheers Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 Uisce beatha, 'water of life' is Whiskey. Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desmond7 Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 (edited) According to Richard Holmes in 'Redcoat' - there is a connection to serving in the West Indies. The idea being that medical thought at the time recommended 'strong drink' (and rum was plentiful in West Indies) as a 'medicinal aid' against fevers etc. That's how I read it anyway. Des I should make it plain I am talking about the introduction of rum to the British army long before WW1! Edited 31 January , 2006 by Desmond7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truthergw Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 Any ideas why rum was served up to the British and Irish troops on a daily basis rather than the national drink of the islands, uisce beatha? Cheers Steve Like Desmond, I think that spirits were thought to have medicinal value. It was of course issued in the Royal Navy as well. Being of a cynical turn of mind, if I really wanted to know why vast quantities of anything were issued to the services for many many years, I'd be inclined to wonder who supplied the stuff. Cui bono? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrieduncan Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 Did they not used to give rum to sailors on ships for hundreds of years, plainly because the water was of such poor quality? Maybe it has sometime to do with that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truthergw Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 Did they not used to give rum to sailors on ships for hundreds of years, plainly because the water was of such poor quality? Maybe it has sometime to do with that? Well Barrie, I have met a few matelots who drank rum, and any other alcohol they could get their hands on, like water, but not instead of water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils Own Posted 31 January , 2006 Author Share Posted 31 January , 2006 Did they not used to give rum to sailors on ships for hundreds of years, plainly because the water was of such poor quality? Maybe it has sometime to do with that? I'm all for drinking spirits rather than water (whatever the quality). I am just wondering why whiskey was not given out instead of rum. I would have been quite disappointed as I would have preferred whiskey. Here's another idea. Did the officers get whiskey perhaps and the men rum because the latter was cheaper to produce? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrieduncan Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 I dont mean that they drank rum all the time. I'm going back a bit here, when the water was very poor and they didn't get the chance to refill it all that often. They supplemented what little water they had with rum rations? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrel Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 There is a long "tradition" of alchoholic substances being supplied to soldiers. In Napoleonic times beer and gin were ration items but only because the water supplies, even in UK, were full of all sorts of nasty things. Drink was looked upon as "medicinal" long before WW1 and rum was probably chosen because of the ready supply from the West Indies. The official issue quantity was not enough to get drunk on if you stuck to your own but there were, of course, those who didn't and those who always had a little extra tucked away. Drink was very popular at the time and that's why we had the recently changed laws on opening hours brought in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desmond7 Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 The phrase 'small beer' comes from the practice of serving a very low alc. content beer as opposed to water in medieval times! Time Team source!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roxy Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 I am certain that most officers would have drunk whisky rather than whiskey! (No offence Des et al!) Roxy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Sweeney Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 Rum was issued "neat". That is undiluted at about 80% vol/160 US proof. The daily issue, if allowed, was 1/64th Gallon , which to a Jack Tar was the exact same 1/8th pint Pusser's rum issue which was the "ToT" that made up the "grog" by dilution with water. Joe Sweeney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrel Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 I'm sure the RASC would have been pleased if every soldier had been able to state a preference! And, it should be whiskey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KONDOA Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 The predominant reason that rum is the drink of the navy and army is that it was made from the waste product of cane sugar manufacture. Other spirits required grain which could be made at home. The issue of rum solved the problem of how to get rid of the mollasses in the West Indies and South America. Roop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul guthrie Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 Rum was issued "neat". That is undiluted at about 80% vol/160 US proof. The daily issue, if allowed, was 1/64th Gallon , which to a Jack Tar was the exact same 1/8th pint Pusser's rum issue which was the "ToT" that made up the "grog" by dilution with water. Joe Sweeney Two reasons IMHO, rum was cheaper and stronger. Years ago when I would do long distance backpacking, say 125 miles, 10 days in Rockies, weight was the enemy, hence for the one night we would drink alcohol we brought grain alcohol, 180 proof, 90% alcohol. Forty miles from the nearest road and mixed with Tang pretty good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Broomfield Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 Are we discussing two things? The rum was 'ration' - before an attack, to keep cold out, etc - controlled by the QM. Officers would have whiskey, but as a private purchase in the Mess (even if that was a dugout). The rum wasn't a 'social' drink in the way the officers' whiskey was - out of the Line, French beer (weak stuff, they claimed), vin ordinaire, and just about anything else. Rum might also not just have been a way to use up unwanted by-products, but also a way to help keep the W Indian economy going. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gporta Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 ... So I imagine that the French Poilus were issued with red wine for similar sanitary reasons that the Tommies were given a daily dose of Rhum. Were the Germans likewise given some spirit with medicinal properties or did self-prescribe themselves with Marzenbier? Did Russian soldiers get a regular supply of vodka? Gloria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marina Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 It's a great cure for chesty colds and also travel sickness - the black Navy stuff, i mean. Marina Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desmond7 Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 Somewhere .. deep in the murky depths of this forum .. is a chilling report into the chemical make-up of the beer on sale in the average estaminet. Two words ... not healthy. I challenge the searchers to find it. It horrified me. Des Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KONDOA Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 Steven Broomfield - "Rum might also not just have been a way to use up unwanted by-products, but also a way to help keep the W Indian economy going." Yes, and it still is to some extent. The EU issues a quota for Proof neutral spirit every year or two to the producing countries. Roop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joseph Posted 31 January , 2006 Share Posted 31 January , 2006 Other than it tastes nice, takes away those niggling thoughts of being killed or badly wounded and assisted the management to achieve its aim. It may be because it was part of the daily ration, if of course you where allowed to have it? Me I think my friends would most certainly have been awarded a RATA medal. British Daily Ration, 1914: 1 1/4 lb fresh or frozen meat, or 1 lb preserved or salt meat; 1 1/4 lb bread, or 1 lb biscuit or flour; 4 oz. bacon; 3 oz. cheese; 5/8 oz. tea; 4 oz. jam; 3 oz. sugar; 1/2 oz salt; 1/36 oz. pepper; 1/20 oz. mustard; 8 oz. fresh or 2 oz. dried vegetables; 1/10 gill lime juice if fresh vegetables not issued;* 1/2 gill rum;* not exceeding 2 oz. tobacco per week. (* at discretion of commanding general.) Regards Charles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Broomfield Posted 1 February , 2006 Share Posted 1 February , 2006 1/2 gill rum;* (* at discretion of commanding general.) Regards Charles And I believe Major General Pinney (33rd Division) was TT - no rum for them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Posted 1 February , 2006 Share Posted 1 February , 2006 The phrase 'small beer' comes from the practice of serving a very low alc. content beer as opposed to water in medieval times! Time Team source!! In the past the breweries used to draw a second brew from the mash after the first and stronger brew had been drawn. This was necessarily weaker than the first and was called 'small beer'. Like putting more hot water into the teapot to make a second cup of tea. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truthergw Posted 1 February , 2006 Share Posted 1 February , 2006 ... So I imagine that the French Poilus were issued with red wine for similar sanitary reasons that the Tommies were given a daily dose of Rhum. Were the Germans likewise given some spirit with medicinal properties or did self-prescribe themselves with Marzenbier? Did Russian soldiers get a regular supply of vodka? Gloria Not quite. The Poilus were issued with wine,' pinard' , in the way that Tommies were issued with tea. To accompany meals. Rum was a ration, at the discretion of CO, issued for vaguely medicinal, psychological reasons. It warmed you up, it made you feel better and it was thought to be ' good for you '. I don't know if the French had a similar issue of cognac or something like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 1 February , 2006 Share Posted 1 February , 2006 At one time, small beer was extensively brewed by women at home, who would sell off any surplus for a profit. It did not keep very long, so it was more or less brewed for immediate consumption as an alternative to water, which was often not safe to drink. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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