HOSPITAL SHIP, CARISBROOK CASTLE

[rlndhorne]

Hello,

Does anyone have any information on the Hospital Ship 'Carisbrook Castle'? Any information or suggestions will be most welcome. Thanks.

Take Care

[auchonvillerssomme]

Period of service03/09/14 to 26/08/19 accomodated 439

Mick

[birchp]

Union Castle Line help mark the transitional benchmarks set by the 1894 Royal Mail Ship CARISBROOK CASTLE in the steam/sail conversion era. The final single-screw vessel of the line, she was built of steel and carried three masts to supplement her Fairfield Shipbuilding & Engineering Company’s own quadruple-expansion four-cylinder steam engine that put out an amazing nominal 1,490 H.P. and 8,500 indicated horse power. The company had decided to divest the last of their sailing ships, including the original CARISBROOK CASTLE, a three-masted square-rigger, in 1889.

There are 12 ship’s boats hanging in davits, with the deck rails wrapping the decks. The superstructure has its open bridge where the appropriate instruments are on display. Rising behind and parallel to the fully rigged masts, the red with black accent funnel is stalwart and centrally located. The hull is painted in the company red and gray, and the single four-blade propeller is smartly ready to cut. The model is aloft on four turned brass columns in the hardwood and glass case, with the original ivorine builders’ and specification plates secured at each end.

The liner was built in Glasgow by Fairfield’s, and she registered at 7,626 gross tons for her 485 foot length with a 56 foot beam. She had accommodations for 250 First Class Passengers placed amidship rather than at the stern, the first Union Castle Ship so arraigned, and 140 Second Class aft. Her maiden voyage and the subsequent year’s were from London to Cape Town, South Africa. She hit a normal cruising speed of 16 knots, and could reach 17½ knots when pushed. In 1900, with the rest of the line, they became the Union-Castle Line and CARISBROOK CASTLE moved her home port to Southampton. In 1910 she ran her last Cape Town service, and was relegated to a role as a reserve steamer behind BALMORAL CASTLE.

Four years into reserve service, fate brought the World to war, and the CARISBROOK CASTLE began again in military duty. Commandeered two days before the formal declaration of war in 1914, she started as a hospital ship with 439 beds, and crossed the English Channel to bring wounded troops home from the Western Front. She shifted roles to that of an Army Troop Ship in the Mediterranean for most of the war. She returned to Union-Castle service in 1919, sailing in Cape mail service until the launch of Union-Castle’s WINDSOR CASTLE, and was laid up at Netlev and retired from all duties in 1922

[auchonvillerssomme]

Do you have a picture of it I can add to my archive?

Mick

[birchp]

Photophoto of model

Do you have a picture of it I can add to my archive?

Mick

[auchonvillerssomme]

Thank you

Mick

[Guest colinwootten]

Photophoto of model

Hi I have a postcard from my fathers belongings which showed the carisbrook castle as a hospital ship I would like any information about passengers that may have used the ship I know my father was gassed but I dont know where I also have postcards from randelstown and buttevant barracks but have no information about when he was there and his further service although it was said he became a batman. originally he was a machine gunner in the suffolk regiment.

[redescort]

Hi I have a postcard from my fathers belongings which showed the carisbrook castle as a hospital ship I would like any information about passengers that may have used the ship I know my father was gassed but I dont know where I also have postcards from randelstown and buttevant barracks but have no information about when he was there and his further service although it was said he became a batman. originally he was a machine gunner in the suffolk regiment.

Colina

What was his name and number and where did he serve some of the men of the 1/5th suffolk Reg which I have in my database were invalided from Gallipoli on the H.S. Carisbrook Castle.

Ray

[Guest colinwootten]

Colina

What was his name and number and where did he serve some of the men of the 1/5th suffolk Reg which I have in my database were invalided from Gallipoli on the H.S. Carisbrook Castle.

Ray

Hi my dad was J W Wootten his number in the suffolk regiment was 240844 although on his medal card he was also in the glosters 260019 and in MGC 156729 still looking for info where he served he was in hospital in huddersfield but I have no dates.

thanks

[Anne Henderson]

Hi my dad was J W Wootten his number in the suffolk regiment was 240844 although on his medal card he was also in the glosters 260019 and in MGC 156729 still looking for info where he served he was in hospital in huddersfield but I have no dates.

thanks

I have recently got hold of a copy of my Grandfather's military records from The National Archives at Kew and have discovered that he left the HS Carisbrooke Castle at Southampton on 13th March 1917 to go to a rest camp there. My Grandfather was 1525 Pte Robertson MM, RAMC, and HS Carisbrooke Castle was a hospital ship.

[Anne Henderson]

Hello,

Does anyone have any information on the Hospital Ship 'Carisbrook Castle'? Any information or suggestions will be most welcome. Thanks.

Take Care

I have recently got hold of a copy of my Grandfather's military records from The National Archives at Kew and have discovered that he left the HS Carisbrooke Castle at Southampton on 13th March 1917 to go to a rest camp there. My Grandfather was 1525 Pte Robertson MM, RAMC, and HS Carisbrooke Castle was a hospital ship.

[KIWIWAYNE]

During researching 49108 Private Albert Leggett, Royal Army Medical Corps, it is recorded that he was transported on the Hospital Ship HMHS Carisbrooke Castle, from France to England.   This was about 3rd November 1916 after he had been admitted to hospital with bronchitis.    He had two other bouts of sickness, 8th October 1917 with inflammation of connective tissue in the feet and on 5th April 1918 with inflammation of connective tissue, 2nd finger (left).

 

[ZeZe]

Hi

H.M.H.S. Carisbrook Castle, photo taken at Alexandria Docks (I’ve enhanced the contrast): https://wellcomecollection.org/works/k87jpa7p/items?canvas=35; Licence: Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0 International (CC BY-NC 4.0)

Credit: Photographs of Private S.J.G. Stevens and of hospitals and hospital ships in Palestine, the Dardanelles and Salonica (Thessaloniki, Greece). Wellcome Collection.

A timeline (additions/corrections welcome).

The forum ‘Hospital Ship Oxfordshire’ highlighted the conflicting information regarding Wilkin, Slater & Stronach, and which was the A/Matron serving on H.M.H.S. Oxfordshire and H.M.H.S. Carrisbrook Castle in the first year of WW1. I’m now thinking that Maud McCarthy’s diary is more likely to be correct than the info in the files. Here are the various A.Matrons, ships & dates:

I can only find a small amount information on H.M.H.S. Carisbrook Castle, the individual nurse files contain little detail of life on the ship. As the War Diary for Carisbrook Castle commences on 1st January 1917 (sailing on the cross Channel runs) I’ve laid out a few of Carisbrook Castle’s movements 1914/1916 from other sources.

It appears that a decision to transfer H.M.H.S. Carisbrook Castle from Royal Naval command to War Office command took place a few weeks after the commencement of WW1. National Archives' reference ADM 104/92 page 592, a note states ‘Hospital Carrier No 3. (SS “Carisbrook Castle” will turnover to Hospital Ship No. 5 SS “Rewa”). Four Q.A.R.N.N.S. Sister’s are recorded as being on board Carisbrook Castle from the 3rd to the 27th August 1914. (strange coincidence their end date being 27th and the Q.A.I.M.N.S. nurses posting date also the 27th, but a month apart)

The newspaper report dated 6th August 1914: ‘News Telegram states that the Union Castle liners Carisbrook Castle and Dunvegan Castle have been fitted up as hospital ships and passed Cowes yesterday afternoon on their way to the area of hostilities’.

*   *   *

The first sailing I can find officially recorded in a war diary was on the 6th September, Base No. 3 (St Nazaire) ‘Carisbrook Castle left for England’ with no other details given (**WO-95-4010-1_024).

On the 8th the ship was back in the outer harbour at St Nazaire, docked on the 11th and two days later left for England with 355 sick and wounded including 7 British officers, 7 German officers and 15 other ranks German (**WO-95-4010-1_018).

Third trip 18th / 19th September.

Forth trip 23rd / 25th September.

If the timeline is correct, there were no nurses were on board during these trips. 

From 18th October onwards the evacuation of wounded on H.M.H.S. Carisbrook Castle switches from the port of St Nazaire to that of Boulogne.

**Source of the sailings: Lines of communication. Boulogne Base, Deputy Director Medical Services: https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/d1e31350045048bd95e8021469ab514c

*   *   *

Mentioned in the newspapers, during February 1915: H.M.H.S. Carisbrook Castle arrived in Dublin with 488 wounded soldiers from the trenches in France.

*   *   *

Gallipoli campaign, Mudros Bay, Lemnos, Embarkation Officers War Diary:

19th November 1915, Hospital Ship Carisbrook Castle arrived from Malta.

5th February 1916, Hospital Ship Carisbrook Castle arrived from Alexandria.

7th February 1916, Hospital Ship Carisbrook Castle sailed for Alexandria today.

In Alice Honeywood’s file (WO 399/3956), notification her mother was dying and the Authorities needed to to get in touch with Alice: ‘Carisbrook Castle left Port Augusta for Malta 30.03.16 & is now probably on her way back to Salonika’  signed 07.04.16.

*   *   *

Low res photos,

Hospital Ship Carisbrook Castle in dazzle camouflage: https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/C2080362

Hospital Ship Carisbrook Castle, C Ward: https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/C2080370

Regards ZeZe

Edited 4 July , 2023 by ZeZe

[alf mcm]

Very interesting ZeZe.

  This short article mentionig Zilla Jones comes from the Belfast Weekly Telegraph of 13th February 1915, courtesy B.N.A./Findmypast.

Regards,

Alf McM

[ZeZe]

Hi Alf,

I’m glad you found the posting. Have you any further thoughts on the A/Matron issue?

Regards ZeZe

[FionaBam]

Hi Zeze

Very interesting.  Am amazed at the size of C Ward from the picture/ your link. Dont know what exactly I was expecting but nothing with that ceiling height and spaciousness.  Guess it varied hugely depending on the size of the vessel 

 

Cheers

Fiona 

[andrew pugh]

Hi All

My Great Uncle was shipped back to England on the Carisbrooke Castle after being wounded on the 13th November 1916 on the Redan Ridge.

Regards

Andy

[FionaBam]

"Guess it varied hugely depending on the size of the vessel "

the clue is there of course in the ships original role : " liner ". 

 

[alf mcm]

13 hours ago, ZeZe said:

Hi Alf,

I’m glad you found the posting. Have you any further thoughts on the A/Matron issue?

Regards ZeZe

ZeZe,

  I couldn't find any more naval nurses, so it looks like there were only ever 4.

A number of other nurses were 'bad sailors';

Miss M.SMITH

Mrs MOFFAT - HS 'Brighton'

Miss SPENCE - HS 'Brighton'

A/Matron SMARTT - HS 'Cambria'

Mrs BALL - HS 'Jan Breydel'

A/Sister WINFIELD - HS 'Aberdonian'

  I will try and figure out the situation with Acting Matrons.

Regards,

Alf McM

 

[FionaBam]

Oh dear ...being classed as a " bad sailor " ...must have been very disappointing for the nurses not to be able to fulfil their role. 

 

[ZeZe]

Hi Fiona,

I too was taken aback by “C Ward”, the big clock and beautiful woodwork. As you say the clue is in the word liner, I guess “C Ward” was the first class dining room / ballroom. The beds were presumably screwed down otherwise it would have been chaos in a storm, can you image all the holes in the polished timber floor in 1919 when the ship was handed back to Union & Castle?

As a Military Hospital Ship the official compliment of Sisters & Nurses was 12 with the help of 38 R.A.M.C. / St John Amb. caring for 16 Officers, 196 Cot cases & 227 Berths.

*   *   *

Hi Alf,

I have also seen quite a few ‘bad sailors’ in the files. Ships are not for me either.

*   *   *

Hi Andy,

I wonder what date Carisbrook Castle returned from the Med to the Channel, it was before November 1916 from your evidence.

Regards ZeZe

Edited 5 July , 2023 by ZeZe

[alf mcm]

ZeZe,

   Maud McCarthy received confirmation that Carisbrooke Castle, Asturias and Oxfordshire were back on the BEF route on 4th March 1916.

Regards,

Alf McM

[FionaBam]

Hi Zeze

Thanks for the staff compliment details. My maths makes that approx. 50 patients per nurse . We can all imagine that ratio  comparing it with our own experience of hospital wards nowadays and their nursing care of our loved ones.

Yes a new floor ? Probably not as she became a Mail Ship plying the route to Cape Town and back. Sobering thoughts for her crew to consider what those holes in her dining room floor represented and who had been aboard her before them.

Perhaps off the subject of WW1 but I am posting the link to more photos of the Carisbrook Castle, a fine looking vessel with the long low lines and overhanging stern of the  classic  huge J Class Yachts of its day. 

Very entertaining article also here about the ship striking an underwater object in 1919 and ensuing repairs in Durban and their new staff tasks whilst moored up/ tied alongside in Cape Town Harbour.The comment about the brandy bonus   reward for staff is very funny .

 

https://bandcstaffregister.com/page1962.html

Broken up in 1922.what a waste. 

Cheers

Fiona 

 

Please remove if this isnt relevant.  Thanks 

Edited 5 July , 2023 by FionaBam
Corrections of facts

[alf mcm]

ZeZe,

  Another nurse, Adela Stones {WO399/8014} served from October 1916.

Article from Shipley Times & Express, 12th March 1920. If the ship's complement was 12 nurses then there are still a few to discover.

Image courtesey B.N.A./Findmypast.

Regards,

Alf McM

[alf mcm]

On 04/07/2023 at 18:45, ZeZe said:

Hi Alf,

I’m glad you found the posting. Have you any further thoughts on the A/Matron issue?

Regards ZeZe

Hello ZeZe,

   Here are my thoughts on Miss Wilkin and Assistant Matrons. There are still some grey areas, especially for December 1914.

Sister Maude Elizabeth WILKIN, Q.A.I.M.N.S.

  Date of embarkation 14/08/14, aboard H.S. St. Andrew {B.E.F.}

  Replaced on un-named Hospital Ship {possibly ‘Oxfordshire’ or ‘Carisbrook Castle’} by Miss STRONACH as she was a bad sailor, on or just after 07/10/14. By this time Maude would have been on board ship for over 7 weeks. If she was such a bad sailor then it would have been found out sooner. Her first ship, ‘St. Andrew’, was a pre-war channel ferry, designed for the short crossing between England and Ireland. On it’s first journey with patients, it sailed down the Siene to Rouen to Le Havre. {65 miles by road but probably a similar distance by river}, and then to England. Perhaps Maude didn’t have a problem sailing on ‘St. Andrew’. At some point she appears to have been transferred to either the ‘Oxfordshire’ or ‘Carisbrook Castle’. These were a different style of ships, liners built for travelling at relative speed on the open sea. Not much chance of this between England and France, so the ships might not have been too comfortable at slower speeds. Also, because they were bigger ships there was always a chance of waiting in the outer harbour, whilst an earlier ship was loaded and then departed. It can’t have been pleasant being stuck on a ship in the same spot for a long time and with no patients to look after. Perhaps Maude was not a good sailor on the bigger ships.

  There are only 2 ‘Wilkin’ nurses on the medal rolls, and Maude is the only one to be awarded the 1914-14 Star. This means she must be the Miss Wilkin who was replaced by Miss Stronach.

  The war diaries in the WO95/4010 series {thanks for the link ZeZe} are very good for showing arrivals and departures of hospital ships. On 01/10/14 ‘St. Andrew’ was in dock at St. Nazaire loading with sick and wounded patients for transport to England, leaving at 6.16p.m. with 92 sick and wounded patients. Also on board were Miss HILL, C.H.R., who was sick, and Miss NEWMAN who was to look after her.

  ‘Carisbrook Castle’ was also in the dock, and was loaded with 584 patients.

  In view of the ‘St. Andrew’ and ‘Carisbrook Castle’ being in harbour together it is possible that this is where Maude Wilkins transferred to ‘Carisbrook Castle’. This may have been because Miss Hill was one of the nursing staff or because there were so many patients on ‘Carisbrook Castle’ compared to ‘St. Andrew’. There may of course ben some other reason.

  I think Miss Hill is Miss A. Hill, Q.A.I.M.N.S.R. mentioned on the 1914-15 Star roll marked ‘Carisbrook Castle’. I have not been able to identify her first name.

  ‘Carisbrook Castle’ returned to the harbour for another load on 5^th October, but did not start loading until 7^th.

On the same day Maud McCarthy asked Miss Stronach to replace Miss Wilkin on the hospital ship. On 7^th October ‘Oxfordshire’ had just left the harbour. ‘Carisbrook’ was the only ship in the dock, and was loading. This means that Miss Wilkin must have been aboard ‘Carisbrook’.

Sister Catherine Geddes STRONACH, Q.A.I.M.N.S.

Medal card states disembarked France 17/08/14

  Miss Stronach replaced Miss Wilkin on ‘Carisbrook Castle’ probably on 07/10/14. There is no mention of either of them being Acting Matrons. Catherine’s service record {page 11} states that she was appointed to ‘Oxfordshire’ on 07/10/14. It is possible that Maud McCarthy’s telegram was received before ‘Oxfordshire’ sailed, and so Sister Geddes transferred to ‘Carisbrook Castle’.

Catherine was definitely A/Matron on ‘Carisbrook Castle’ by 27/10/14, when she was visited by Maud McCarthy.

  Catherine was serving on a Hospital Ship on 23/12/14 when she visited Maud McCarthy at Boulogne.  Unfortunately the D.D.M.S. War Diary for December 1914 has not been digitized, all other months have been copied. The record for December 1914 appears to exist as a hard copy, in file WO-95-4010. This file appears to contain all months from August 1914 until July 1915. The December file would need to be seen to confirm which ship Miss Stronach was serving on.

  Catherine’s service record says that she transferred to 8 Stationary Hospital on 25/03/15. This appears to be a mistake since she was replaced by Miss POTTER on 25/02/15.

Sister Mary Louise POTTER, Q.A.I.M.N.S.

  Mary replaced Miss STRONACH as Acting Matron on Carisbrook Castle on 25/02/15. Her service record states {P15} that she was not officially appointed Acting Matron until 06/04/15. This was 3 days after Miss STEENSON left for 14 Stationary Hospital. It could be that Mary had actually been temporary Acting Matron on 25/02/15, perhaps because Miss Steenson was on leave or ill. Once Miss Steenson came back on duty Mary would have reverted to ‘Sister’. Mary was still Acting Matron of ‘Carisbrook Castle’ on 16/08/15.

Acting Matron Margaret STEENSON, Q.A.I.M.N.S.

  Margaret STEENSON was Acting Matron of ‘Oxfordshire’ at Le Havre on 12/10/14 when she was visited by Maud McCarthy.

  Margaret visited Maud McCarthy at Boulogne from her [un-named] ship on 22/12/14. As for Miss STRONACH above, the D.D.M.S. War Diary for December 1914 has not been digitized. The December file would need to be seen to confirm which ship Miss Steenson was serving on.

  On 03/04/15 Margaret was instructed to proceed to Boulogne from ‘Carisbrook Castle’ for matron’s duties at 14 Stationary Hospital. It is not known where ‘Carisbrook Castle’ was at the time, but it was not in dock at Boulogne. The only ships at Boulogne were ‘St David’, ‘St Patrick’ and ‘Grainaig’. Margaret was replaced by Miss SLATER on the same day. Looking at Miss Slater’s service record it would appear that Maud McCarthy was wrong by referring to ‘Carisbrooke Castle’ instead of ‘Oxfordshire’.

Acting Matron Marianne Lidell SLATER, Q.A.I.M.N.S.

  Marianne Lidell SLATER was requested to replace Miss STEENSON as Acting Matron, ‘Carisbrook Castle’ on 03/04/15. However, her service record shows that she was appointed to ‘Oxfordshire’ on 11/04/15. Since ‘Oxfordshire’ is the only ship mentioned in Marianne’s service record it would appear that Maud McCarthy had made an error by referring to ‘Carisbrook Castle’.

  On 01/10/15, whilst at Marseilles, Marianne requested a transfer.

Let me know what you think.

Regards,

Alf McM